[MDPE]

I’m looking for some video editing software that will let me:

1) Cut bits out of a video, for example when I’ve left the camera running and filmed the floor for half an hour.

2) Cobine videos files so I can get all the vidoes from different tapes into one file.

3) Save video in a different format - it’s all from an old miniDV camcorder and so is 25Mb/s MPEG2+PCM and I’d like to re-encode it in something like h.264+MP3 to make it smaller.

I’ve been trying some demos of products like Sony Vegas and Corel VideoStudio and they’re not at all at all what I’m looking for. This software seems to be for assembling small clips into a full video and adding text and effects. I’m not looking to create a professional video, just cut out a few bits that I don’t want.

Any suggestions what I should use?

[ajwatson]

surley u can use the freevideo editing software that comes with windows?

Im no expert but i use movie maker that came on my pc with windows vista i just put the clips in and tell it when to start and finish cutting all the crap out or the swearing and then piece it togther with title screens and credits and sometimes music over the top of the video sound if the sound quality was poor.

Like i said im no expert but give it a shot its easy to use and once uve got all your clips in it, it saves what it calls the project into a single video file of your choice.

[mmace]

any video editor is designed to do exactly what you are wanting to do which is edit a video. the software you mentioned is perfect for the job

[senu]

Originally Posted by mmace

any video editor is designed to do exactly what you are wanting to do which is edit a video. the software you mentioned is perfect for the job

Totally agree
that is infact what editing is about in the most basic of terms
You need to not use Corel in a " wizard mode" for assembling clips If you do, you are not using it the right way

Similarly Vegas ( or Movie Studio) is well regarded editing software which make child's play of trimming and reassembling video: I think you may have glossed over it as its GUI is not immediately intuitive but it is very easy to use for simple edits once you know how

I Speak as one who has probably used most of them and have the titles you mention on my PCs as well as many others including Adobe Premere CS4 , Premiere Elements 7 and Avid LIQUID 7
They differ mainly in GUI and advanced features: trimming as you describe is easily possible with all of them

Just a note on your intended output.. why h.264? unless you are aiming for you tube or web streaming this will result in quite poor video.
Also for audio AFAIK you cannoy encode audi froma video as MP3.. there are compressed audio formats for video but mp3 is not one of them
Also MiniDV is not "old" and it isnt normally Mpeg2 25( that is HDV Hi def on tape).
it is DV AVI + LCPM ( or WAV) which is big bt even compressing to mpeg2(DVD 2-8Mbps) you sould still get good quality smaller files

[MDPE]

Thanks for the replies. I messed around with it a bit more and found out how to remove bits. I used to do it on my Sony DVD recorder and I thought using software would make it a faster process but it's actually a lot slower and less convenient. It's rather painstaking with large amounts of video and I wish it just had an A-B delete mode like the DVD recorder.

As for h.264 I thought that would be good since it's the format used for Blu-ray and for HD camcorders from Sanyo and Samsung and is much more efficient than MPEG-2. Unfortunately I've found that VideoStudio only seems to support h.264 for mobile devices.

[rogs]

I find the best way to do what you are describing is to import the DV footage into the free program Virtualdub.
Use that to 'append' (add) various DV clips together, to make one big file, do simple cuts, and then export as H.264 by using the free SourceForge.net: x264vfw codec.

You can select the settings using that codec to give very high quality results - not just the 'mobile device' quality you mentioned.

The downside is that you'll have to spend a bit of time 'learning' an application like Virtualdub - it's not designed with a beginner's 'wizard' type interface! There are tutorials all over the net for Virtualdub, if you need them.

But it is capable of very high quality results - and it is free!

Just another option!

[senu]

Originally Posted by MDPE

Thanks for the replies. I messed around with it a bit more and found out how to remove bits. I used to do it on my Sony DVD recorder and I thought using software would make it a faster process but it's actually a lot slower and less convenient. It's rather painstaking with large amounts of video and I wish it just had an A-B delete mode like the DVD recorder.

It is better with software as that is a non destructive process and mistakes can be rectified. Sofware has a learnong curve which once you get past becomes almost secind nature. The trimming with likes of vegas is exceptionally easy IMHO
I also have an LG DVD recorder with HDD which you can " edit with" and though you can do it simply.. Once you get the hang of software it can be just as quick and more precise

As for h.264 I thought that would be good since it's the format used for Blu-ray and for HD camcorders from Sanyo and Samsung and is much more efficient than MPEG-2

h.264 as used in BD is a different beast from the h.264 used in the Sanyo and Samsung camcorders.. different codec and they are mosre compressed ad nt as good as SD Moeg2 as is found in DVD video
AVCHD is much better quality but harder to edit, een so the AVC footage you find in BD is of a higher profile than that prodced by Hi def amcorder whch output AVCHD
h.264 as outpt by Samsung ect is really best for if you are aiming at te likesof You tube. ( read m MX20 " review in the sticky of this very forum". )

Unfortunately I've found that VideoStudio only seems to support h.264 for mobile devices.

This is the case with many such software though . if you simply want Mpeg4 it really doesnt have to be the h.264 implementation

[MDPE]

Originally Posted by rogs

I find the best way to do what you are describing is to import the DV footage into the free program Virtualdub.
Use that to 'append' (add) various DV clips together, to make one big file, do simple cuts, and then export as H.264 by using the free SourceForge.net: x264vfw codec.

That's fantastic and is exactly what I was looking for. It's instantly obvious how to use and lets you do edits extremely fast. I was essentially l looking for something that worked in the same way as you edit sound files in Audacity and that's pretty much what this is.

Originally Posted by rogs

IThe downside is that you'll have to spend a bit of time 'learning' an application like Virtualdub

Quite to the contrary it's extremely easy to use and took me the best part of five seconds to work out how to do an edit. Instead of all the faffing around you have to do with the likes of VideoStudio you just select your start point, press Home, select the end point and press End and then hit Delete and you can navigate with the cursor keys so don't even have to touch the mouse. That's the problem with most commercial software these days, they try to simplify things to the point where their software is impossible to use. Microsoft have done it with Vista and Office 2007 by removing "confusing" menus so now you can't find anything you're looking for.

The h.264 support is also great. You can get the same quality as MPEG2 but in a much smaller file size and it plays great on a Western Digital WD TV.

[senu]

Originally Posted by MDPE

That's fantastic and is exactly what I was looking for. It's instantly obvious how to use and lets you do edits extremely fast. I was essentially l looking for something that worked in the same way as you edit sound files in Audacity and that's pretty much what this is.



Quite to the contrary it's extremely easy to use and took me the best part of five seconds to work out how to do an edit. Instead of all the faffing around you have to do with the likes of VideoStudio you just select your start point, press Home, select the end point and press End and then hit Delete and you can navigate with the cursor keys so don't even have to touch the mouse. That's the problem with most commercial software these days, they try to simplify things to the point where their software is impossible to use. Microsoft have done it with Vista and Office 2007 by removing "confusing" menus so now you can't find anything you're looking for.

The h.264 support is also great. You can get the same quality as MPEG2 but in a much smaller file size and it plays great on a Western Digital WD TV.

Im glad you found what you wanted
Not everybody finds virtual dub so intuitive

Also h.264 may be all you need but is is not at all mpeg quality in SD especially at mpeg2s better encoding bitrates . This is why Sanyo output and Samsung are not necessarily the first choice of anyone wanting to output to DVD video although for PC viewing ( and in you case via the WD media player ) it seems to be fine. In Particuar Samsungs seems to aim at Youtube uploaders rather than anyone wishing to make a nice quality DVD video, the advantage being you don't need a big card to score video
This is just so anyone else considering it be aware that their mileage may vary and Video Studio may ( in its handholding ) be annoying but for anyone wishing to have a bit more control over the editing and do more than just trim the time invest in the likes of Vegas/Premiere Elements ect will yeald benefits, eventually, Particularly if their editing aspirations grow

[timcs]

I use TMPGenc DVD author 3 (I think it has gone to a newer version now) and this allows the trimming cutting etc of videos. With combining clips you add the files into the project and there is an option to link clips together on the properties of the track that these clips are apart of.

Not tried the link clips to know how well it works though.

hope this helps

[senu]

Nero Vision ( part of the Nero Suite) similarly trims edits fairly easily assembles and can output h.264 amongst other's, fairly easily

[timcs]

I have used a free program before called mpeg2cut2 which you can get from here -> Mpg2Cut2

[MDPE]

Thanks for the suggestions. I've been trying some others and have found that I like Avidemux the most. It has the same easy editing as Virtual Dub but supports a much wider range of audio and video codecs and containers. It makes it effortless to produce a h.264 video with vorbis audio in a matroska container.

I don't understand why the commercial video software doesn't have such features. The commercial software is all linked to formats like DVD, Blu-ray and DV but people are moving more towards media servers now instead of having the hassle of optical discs or tapes. It seems that commercial software is well behind and I just couldn't get it to do anything I wanted.

[senu]

Originally Posted by MDPE

I don't understand why the commercial video software doesn't have such features. The commercial software is all linked to formats like DVD, Blu-ray and DV but people are moving more towards media servers now instead of having the hassle of optical discs or tapes.

There is no denying the convenience of media servers but they do rely on having some computer know-how and indeed both the ability and desire to use a network based media server device.. I would suggest that the move you describe is actually rather niche
The vast majority of folk are happy with optical discs and indeed for recording, digital tape is by no means dead, in fact quite alive in the Pro world.
If you vsit the Blue ray forums you will find it teeming with folk who want their full HD video watched at 1080/24p on 50" display with Dolby True HD or DTS Master HD audio
Not everybody wants compressed video best viewed off a PC even HTPC

It seems that commercial software is well behind and I just couldn't get it to do anything I wanted.

The fact remains that the vast majority of high quality video you see streamed from reputable and commercial sites originated fom commercial software
The mkv type files have ( until lately) been more associated with video downloads , some P2P, Torrent and more than a few on shifty legal ground

[rogs]

Originally Posted by senu

I would suggest that the move you describe is actually rather niche

Possibly true at the moment - but I'm not convinced that Blu-ray will ever become as mainstream as DVD.
Although, as you say, many people are happy to do the disc thing all over again, there are an increasing number of us that are not.
Blu ray - particularly recordable Blu ray - is expensive. Yes, it's getting cheaper, but the take up of different options for HD video is slowing down the accaeptance of Blu-ray, and keeping the price up. Catch22 - unless it reaches a critical mass, it will never become as cheap as many people had hoped.
As for the requirement for a high degree of computer 'know how', I'm not convinced. Take something like the the WDTV player. You can take video, in most formats, stored on a hard drive, plug a USB cable from the drive into the player, plug the player into the TV - HDMI or composite - and go. No discs, no networks - simple.

And there a of course several models of a similar type.

And with HDD PVR recorders replacing DVD recorders, people are getting much more used to not having to worry about discs at all.

It's going to take a while, and there will of course always be quite a sizeable group of people who like to have their film collection on disc, but I'm not sure, long term, that discs will remain that important. We shall see!

[senu]

Originally Posted by rogs

Possibly true at the moment - but I'm not convinced that Blu-ray will ever become as mainstream as DVD.

This is possibly more to do with all the fall out of the HD format wars rather than popularity of the downloadable format
Even if BD is not as long-lasting as DVD there is a lot of mileage in the hi def experience of viewing Hi def video on a 46" screen with uncompressed 7.1 audio and rock solid lifelike video

Although, as you say, many people are happy to do the disc thing all over again, there are an increasing number of us that are not.

True there are just as many who have no interest in BD as such but dont feel HD and media servers are the way to go

For instance I have a reasonable collection of DVD discs and slowly growing BD disc but have no problem with watching these off a HDD after ripping .but why should I bother. to actually rip them or even worse turn them to mkv.?

Blu ray - particularly recordable Blu ray - is expensive. Yes, it's getting cheaper, but the take up of different options for HD video is slowing down the accaeptance of Blu-ray, and keeping the price up. Catch22 - unless it reaches a critical mass, it will never become as cheap as many people had hoped.

I agree there, Recordable blu ray may represent a missed opportunity in the industry's bid to protect itself from " piracy" as happened with DVD but I ve owned Hi def camcorder for over 3-4 years now and disappointingly the output format has never been clear

As for the requirement for a high degree of computer 'know how', I'm not convinced. Take something like the the WDTV player. You can take video, in most formats, stored on a hard drive, plug a USB cable from the drive into the player, plug the player into the TV - HDMI or composite - and go. No discs, no networks - simple.

This is true but even given how easy it is to rip audio to MP3 .., snt it a bit surprising that Ive never In truth been to any home where all the CD audio have been ripped to to MP3 on an HDD server ( jukebox)and the CD Audio discs kept away in the loft despite the relative ease of this.
HDD audio juke boxes are still far from commonplace although easily available , Video ones even less so
There is an interesting article in the most current "What Hi fi " comparing the compressed audio formats " to see if in blind tests folk would notice any different

And with HDD PVR recorders replacing DVD recorders, people are getting much more used to not having to worry about discs at all.

True however having Sky + or Sky+ HD does not stop me from buying BD discs whose players are now quite cheap and the discs a lot more affordable

It's going to take a while, and there will of course always be quite a sizeable group of people who like to have their film collection on disc, but I'm not sure, long term, that discs will remain that important. We shall see!

I think there will be " room" for everybody.
Im all for progress but Im not hapy to sacrifice great sounding audio of a well sorted CD audio for mp3s , or a very well sorted sorted BD disc( video and Hi def audio) for an mkv version.. .
And Im sure Im not alone in that
The audio fron hi def is even better than CD quality but I dont see any market for them TBH just as SACD ect or DVD audio never got off the starting blocks
And regarding video there are the teeming masses who ( strangely enough) still love thier DVD's..,. some even still keep those dodgy pirate DVD sellers in business

Im not anti-progress or a pretend audiophile/ videophile but it seems that convenience over quality ( the fast food syndrome) must not be allowed to be the norm.
I do not for a minute think CDs cannot sound better than vinyl LPs but low bitrate compressed video can IMHO be painful to watch on any display over 32" ( if that).. Im sure as time goes on better codecs will be developed and the file based viewing will be a lot more commonplace but I fell it will coexist with rather than oust formats like BD or its succesor

[timcs]

Originally Posted by MDPE

Thanks for the suggestions. I've been trying some others and have found that I like Avidemux the most. It has the same easy editing as Virtual Dub but supports a much wider range of audio and video codecs and containers. It makes it effortless to produce a h.264 video with vorbis audio in a matroska container.

I don't understand why the commercial video software doesn't have such features. The commercial software is all linked to formats like DVD, Blu-ray and DV but people are moving more towards media servers now instead of having the hassle of optical discs or tapes. It seems that commercial software is well behind and I just couldn't get it to do anything I wanted.

You know I have this program and forgot about it I have used it before with other formats but I think I stopped because its version of divx didn't work with my divx player whereas TMPGenc DVD author (makes Divx to) does.