HDCP Encryption - what did/does it all mean

Sorry if this has been posted already, but i did a search and got ton's of results, and i just don't have the time to check them all.

So i read this article

taken from: http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=17211

Microsoft and Sony's next-gen DVD efforts set to be useful after all

Top movie studios look set to delay the HDCP copy protection system - which would only work on next-gen DVD players with HDMI ports, unlike the low-end PS3 and Microsoft's Xbox 360 HD-DVD peripheral - for four to six years.

The move would mean that all movie content produced until 2010 at the earliest, and possibly as far as 2012, will not carry the Image Constraint Token - a security feature which would restrict high-definition playback only to equipment with HDMI ports and HDCP encryption.

Hollywood studios had insisted on this draconian feature, which would encrypt all image data sent between the player and the television (and would consequently mean that users had to have TVs with HDCP-enabled ports as well as new players), as a measure to prevent piracy - and has stuck doggedly to it so far, despite a number of claims that the technology is flawed and will be easily cracked by determined pirates.

However, now leading German newspaper Der Spiegel claims to have information on an unofficial agreement struck between the movie studios and firms including Sony and Microsoft which will see HDCP, and the ICT, being consigned to the scrapheap for at least four years.

The deal has been widely rumoured in technology circles for some time, but further confirmation is offered by the Der Spiegel article - and at a crucial time for Sony and Microsoft, both of whom are set to launch high definition DVD offerings in the coming six months which will lack HDMI ports and HDCP functionality.

While the high end version of Sony's PlayStation 3 will indeed have a HDMI port, the low-end 20GB version (which has not yet been confirmed for launch in the UK) does not; and Microsoft's external HD-DVD player for the Xbox 360 has no HDMI port. Even if Microsoft launches a HDMI cable for the Xbox 360, there's been some speculation that the console would not be able to implement HDCP on this cable.

What this would mean, if the ICT was imposed, is that neither console would be able to output Blu-Ray or HD-DVD content at higher than 480p (540p in North America), thus effectively negating much of the advantage of the next-gen DVD formats. Games would still be able to run at up to 1080i resolution on either system.

Looking beyond consoles, it's also undoubtedly a major factor in this decision that few of the HDTV sets sold so far around the world - and in Japan and North America, market penetration has grown quite quickly - have HDMI ports or HDCP compatibility, meaning that even people who have already bought into the "HD Era" would be forced to buy new screens again to enjoy HD movies.

Faced with this prospect - and the potential of a massive consumer backlash against the HD formats - it's not hard to see why the movie studios have relented, especially given the amount of pressure a firm like Sony can bring to bear in Hollywood. The Japanese giant, through subsidiaries such as Sony Pictures, Columbia, Tristar and MGM, is responsible for around half of the annual movie output of the US industry.

Although the decision is, so far, only a stay of execution - and the movie studios are reportedly quite unhappy with having to relent on their beloved copy protection system, regardless of how flawed or detested it may be - it does mean that HDCP will probably not become a required standard until this generation of consoles is reaching the end of its lifespan.

Now i thought i understood what all this encryption would mean,

To my previous understanding, this encryption would only affect the HDMI socket, and was being implimented because of Hollywood's concern over people making direct digital (lossless) rip's - that all made perfect sense to me.

However, this article seem's to imply, that the encryption would also cripple the standard analogue out ports, down to 480p - is/was this right?

If so, it seems to be an incredibly stupid move on everyone's part

Why would Microsoft even bother releasing the new x360 HD-drive add-on, if it was never going to play HD-discs at any higher resolution than standard dvd's, or likewise, Sony's lo-spec PS3.

I'm completely baffled

And can anyone actually confirm whether it has been dropped? as i don't really see how a German newspaper could have the scoop on something that will be decided between America & Japan

talk about confuuoooooosssed-dot-com

[chrissyman]

well i think hdcp only works in the digital domain
so the component should not be affected as its analogue
i think it might be a problem with sky hd, in a couple of years they may
switch off the component/analogue hd signal and just broadcast in digital/hdmi

have i got this right or am i barking up the wrong tree

[Albion]

Well if the German scoop is true,then its a big injection into the arm of HD-DVD and Blu-ray,because clearly games consoles are purchased by your average joe,who will be equipped with a wide array of displays.
They will be pretty ****** off if they have some mates around to try and watch Final Destination 3 and it turns out like watching a DVD or worse still
a blank screen.

Similarly it will be a way for those to watch HD-DVD Blu-ray who would normally be early adopters (like me) but are very annoyed about the fact that it means I will have to make a choice about a new kitchen or High definition.

[craigizmo2k2]

Originally Posted by Albion

Well if the German scoop is true,then its a big injection into the arm of HD-DVD and Blu-ray,because clearly games consoles are purchased by your average joe,who will be equipped with a wide array of displays.
They will be pretty ****** off if they have some mates around to try and watch Final Destination 3 and it turns out like watching a DVD or worse still
a blank screen.

Similarly it will be a way for those to watch HD-DVD Blu-ray who would normally be early adopters (like me) but are very annoyed about the fact that it means I will have to make a choice about a new kitchen or High definition.

No point in a new kitchen if you have no gorgeous HD tv to make food to watch telly by!

[njp]

Originally Posted by chrissyman

well i think hdcp only works in the digital domain
so the component should not be affected as its analogue
i think it might be a problem with sky hd, in a couple of years they may
switch off the component/analogue hd signal and just broadcast in digital/hdmi

have i got this right or am i barking up the wrong tree

Partially. Yes, HDCP only works in the digital domain, but as part of the HD format licensing conditions, HD sources are supposed to respect (on pain of key revocation) the Image Constraint Token (ICT). The disk packaging is supposed to tell you if that is in use, so that owners of HD displays who only have component or non-HDCP DVI connections will know whether or not to bother purchasing it. If it is in use, HD sources are supposed to limit the image resolution on unencrypted interfaces. Note that "unencrypted" means all analogue connections as well as HDMI or DVI without the use of HDCP.

Sky may well have some equivalent to the ICT which they broadcast. It certainly wouldn't be a case of "switching off the component/analogue hd signal and just broadcasting in digital/hdmi" - the digital format would remain unaltered. All that would change would be what the decoder was allowed to do with it.

[richard plumb]

In Japan, the players are not allowed to obey the ICT flag until 2010-2012, due to the number of people with older analog HD sets (they've had HD a while now)

This decision simply means there won't be any ICT flags used by the major studios until 2010 in the rest of the world.

Result is that if you buy a Bluray/HDDVD drive, you can hook it up by component and get proper 720p/1080i output, unrestricted.


I personally doubt they'll suddenly turn it on in 2010 as it'll pee off exactly the people they are trying to reach with this deal - people with component only TVs.

I think instead you'll never have ICT used - I think manufacturers will simply drop component outputs off their new players from 2010 which will slowly kill off component as people upgrade.

[njp]

Originally Posted by richard plumb

I personally doubt they'll suddenly turn it on in 2010 as it'll pee off exactly the people they are trying to reach with this deal - people with component only TVs.

I think instead you'll never have [ICT] used - I think manufacturers will simply drop component outputs off their new players from 2010 which will slowly kill off component as people upgrade.

The restriction on component output is a bit strange anyway, given that there are (virtually?) no domestic recorders capable of accepting it (although I suppose that could change).

The decision not to use ICT (at least for the time being) means we have the bizarre situation of (unhacked) upscaling SD DVD players not being able to output pseudo HD (where all the extra information has been invented by the player itself) over component, whereas HD players are allowed to output the real deal!

I'm not entirely clear what is allowed to go out over DVI (non-HDCP variant) when ICT is not in use. I can't imagine it's the full resolution data. Is the player even allowed to send SD resolution in this case?

[richard plumb]

I think even HD players will still not be able to upscale DVD over component, as thats a separate issue to do with DVD standards.

So you'll have your toshiba HDDVD playing 1080i (pulldownable to full 1080p/24) movies over component, but limiting DVDs to 480p. Crazy

[njp]

Originally Posted by richard plumb

I think even HD players will still not be able to upscale DVD over component, as thats a separate issue to do with DVD standards.

I don't see how it can be (unless you can point me to chapter and verse, of course!). I had assumed it was a side-effect of HDMI licensing about what could be sent over unprotected interfaces, and didn't actually make any sense in the context of an upscaling player. Since there is no actual ICT to respect, I imagined that DVDs were regarded as having an equivalent constraint simply by virtue of using CSS (even though that is so comprehensively broken you wonder why they'd bother!).

So you'll have your toshiba HDDVD playing 1080i (pulldownable to full 1080p/24) movies over component, but limiting DVDs to 480p. Crazy

Indeed.

[Albion]

I,ve posted this question on another thread as well,but I NEED an answer.
Does this all mean I can also buy a HD-DVD Drive for my PC and display at full resolution on my monitor?

I don't think i'm any clearer on this issue...

and it seems alot of people are confused

[njp]

Originally Posted by darkfader

I don't think i'm any clearer on this issue...

and it seems alot of people are confused

That's because it's a typical Hollywood lawyer driven mess...

However, it does now look as though ICT will not be deployed for several years at least (if ever), for fear of a consumer backlash in the USA, where there are a lot of HD displays without HDMI inputs.

I've seen this confirmed in a number of places, including in an interview with a Sony spokesman, who said that they might review their decision if analogue copying became a significant issue in the future.

Lets face it, however much they winge about piracy and even casual copying, they still make more money out of embracing new formats than by ignoring them.