[grimep]

In a nutshell, all I'm looking for is a processor that decodes DVDs or freeview broadcasts into a 5.1 surround format. I've decided against an AV Receiver, as I don't like the everything-but-the-kitchen-sink approach they tend to take. I don't need 7.1, hdmi throughs, or the latest marketing gimmick. However, I do like the value you get with receivers, and there seems to be a vast leap up to the foothills of budget processors. Scuse my ignorance, but as someone with no experience with processors, the entry price point - probably a low spec Rotel - is still extremely expensive.
Finding a power amp is easier - I want to drive a pmc db1mc+ and possibly a pair of DB1+s at the rear, so a Naim NAP175 would on paper with its 50W pc just scrape by in ability to drive these speakers, and what it lacks in watts should be made up for in sound quality. And it wouldn't be out of place next to the Quad amp driving the front left and right channels.

But what for a processor?? All I want is something that decodes a signal into 5 channels and has a vol control. Why should that cost over a grand?? The cyrus master 8.0 might have been interesting if they hadnt bothered with the 3 built-in 30WPC amp and dropped the price £250.

Is there a piece of kit out there I've missed? Surely £400 - £500 for a decoder/pre isn't asking the earth?

[mhuk05]

You might be able to get a second hand Primare P30 (think that's the model #) for under £500.

[rowlandhills]

I don't think there's much around which is new at that price, but you could look for a second hand Linn AV5103, which is an excellent stereo preamp as well as a 5.1 processor. It often goes for about £500-600 on eBay (compared to an original list price of about £5k!)

You don't say what else it needs to integrate with other than the Quad power amp. Will it be replacing your current preamp, or adding to it? If the latter, does your stereo preamp have a "unity gain" or passthrough input?

[Pop up Dragon]

There is a Lexicon MC1 on ebay,i sort of know the chap who owns it and can say its coming from a good home. Its got a buy it now for £525 , thats a good price for one of those...and you might get it for a bit less.If thats streching you a bit try looking on the for sale sections here or places like hifi for sale.

[grimep]

Thanks for the thoughts.

I don't really want a 2nd hand unit if I can avoid it - warranty / reliability issues - but I'll keep an eye on the suggestions. I like the fact that Linn's aren't hulking great big monsters for a start. I don't know much about the Primare, but their kit is obviously of a very high build quality.

rowlandhills - i won't be replacing my quad 99 preamp, i'll feed it the L/R preouts from the surround processor. Unity gain would be convenient, but 2 vol controls isn't the end of the world.

popupdragon - I was watching Lexicons a little while back - nearly bid on a Mk2 MC12 (& a Mcintosh 5 channel power) a month or 2 ago, but older high end kit comes with reputation for duff reliability, especially the early Lexicons.

I like the idea of the Linn, will have to investigate... I assume it can't handle the latest formats so flush owners will be upgrading. There's one on ebay at the mo for £400. I wonder if it would make a better pre than my Quad?

[Pop up Dragon]

Got to say that some of the things you have said are true........but.Just because its old its not going to break.I've owned Lexicon for 8 years and have had a problem with one psu.I have friends with old Meridians that just go on and on.
If you are looking for a 5.1 controller try finding a new one for the price of a second Hand MC1 or Meridian.If you do it will be pants!!!The thing is ,at the end of the day you pay your money and take your choice.
But dont put down quality old gear,i also have a Quad 34/405/FM4 .i bought this from a friends dad years ago,he bought it new in about 1985 and its never missed a beat.

[grimep]

Oh, I agree that 2nd hand kit can be great value, if you dont mind taking the risk. I guess there's more to go wrong with surround sound processors and multi channel amps. I'd probably trust Primare, shame the processors are so rare 2nd hand, and Linn - well, at least you can get them repaired fairly easily in the UK. But I'm put off the higher end stuff after a couple of conversations with friends in the industry.... early Lexicons that reset if you touch the top of the case, that sort of thing. And I think they'd be overkill in my 5M x 4M semidetached living room. I'll defo be on the lookout for a bargain Primare processor though, the build quality inspires confidence.... and the Linn.

[grimep]

The Primare p30.... was just having a look at the sockets round the back, and I can't see a digital in...? Just seems to have a Neutrik-style 3 pin connector as used on semi-pro and pro recording equipment, and a series of analogue ins for the surround channels... wouldnt this mean I would have to use my (rather cheap) DVD player's A/D converters, rather than what I'd expect to be top quality components in the Primare?

And would I really notice much of a difference in quality? Given that most of the semi-pro 5.1 monitoring solutions for recording studios tend to only have analogue inputs...? Noticed Primare do a 3 channel amp too, so the pair would appear to be ideal for me.

[spiver]

At around £500 you would be so much better to go for a quality 2nd hand processor than to buy a new one. Its not like they have moving parts to go wrong like a CD/DVD player. Dont waste the quality of your speakers on something inferior and dont forget - todays £500 product was probably £2k not so long ago. It will be the hub of your system choose wisely.

By the way Primare kit is excellent. You can find the manual for the P30 here:

http://www.primare.net/documents/00030.pdf

[grimep]

Finding a quality 2nd hand processor for £500 isnt at all easy as im discovering....

why does everything COST SO MUCH DARN MONEY??!!

[mhuk05]

Primare P30; fleabay #200090076805; sold for £435

[Osamede]

How about the Yamaha DSP-E800 AV processor? Is that any good?

[crobo]

Get the MC-1. I got one bundled with the power amp I bought and can't believe how good it is (compared to my Parasound C2).

[morksbeanbag]

The DSP-E800 ain't so good. It was cheap when new, its a quick fix for people with stereo systems.

For just a 5.1 processor look for secondhand Rotel processors you should be able to get something pretty nice for £500. Also i used to use a Sony TA-E9000ES until a couple of months ago, very nice processors, built like a tank too, you can usually get those for £300-£400. Which isn't much at all for how good it is.

[Paul Smith]

Hi,
If you don't want video switching, etc,...
You could always get something like a Denon AVD-2000 (I just picked one up for only £20, bargain ).

Paul.

[Osamede]

I definitley do not want the video switching, since the sound quality is my focus. I took your tip and looked for that Denon, but cannot find any on sale at the moment.

Any other sound-only processors that are good but cheap?

[Paul Smith]

Hi,
There are a number of others that can be picked up relatively cheap,
Providing you are not wanting tons of inputs/outputs.

I'll PM you about another one that I have my eye on .

Paul.

[grimep]

Originally Posted by mhuk05

Primare P30; fleabay #200090076805; sold for £435

thanks, I did have that one on watch but was heading off on me hols when the auction was ending, woulda been ideal!

[grimep]

ok... given that PRimares seem to be a bit on the rare side, what Meridian model could I hope to bag if I up the budget to £800-£999? I'm not at all familiar with their range, but it certainly looks quality

[crobo]

I had the 561 and was really impressed. It was £500 used and did the job very nicely. Not that easy to programme in my experience; you need to go through the website carefully to get the right software but once you work it out it's fine.
I believe the 568.2 is a real step up but the last ones I saw were well over the £1k mark.
Otherwise my MC-1 will be going on sale soon (had to mention it ).

[JonLeach]

Originally Posted by grimep

ok... given that PRimares seem to be a bit on the rare side, what Meridian model could I hope to bag if I up the budget to £800-£999? I'm not at all familiar with their range, but it certainly looks quality

Hello Mr Grime,

i had a rotel RSP-1066 that i sold last year for £450, a very nice processor that will do all that you ask of it and is well under your budget.

i did upgrade to a Meridian 568.2 and that was a step above the rotel i know i wont need to upgrade anymore, although i will be going to DSP speakers after a house move. You might be able to get a 568.1 with that budget of £900 but that might be pushing it, have a look on the meridian forum hitchhikers. Here they only problem you may have is intergrating your stereo setup as the Meridian kit is all digital, best to ask on the meridian forums.

Jon

[C.Wolf]

Cheap but not nasty you say!
The yamaha DSP E800 is a great processor, definately not nasty but very cheap. Sound is great, I use it with naim kit, as do others I know and ive never heard anyone complain about it. It was built for sound with no gimmicks using their mid priced chipset, not the cheap one. When I bought mine the cheapest yamaha amp with this chipset was £1000.
Hope this helps,
Clyde

[Osamede]

I have no personal experience but the Audiolab 8000AV ( http://www.superfi.co.uk/index.cfm/p...roduct_ID/2392 ) is priced at £799 and claims to be based on the Tag McLaren AV30. Worth a closer look, maybe?

[Osamede]

Originally Posted by C.Wolf

Cheap but not nasty you say!
The yamaha DSP E800 is a great processor, definately not nasty but very cheap. Sound is great, I use it with naim kit, as do others I know and ive never heard anyone complain about it. It was built for sound with no gimmicks using their mid priced chipset, not the cheap one. When I bought mine the cheapest yamaha amp with this chipset was £1000.

Originally Posted by morksbeanbag

The DSP-E800 ain't so good. It was cheap when new, its a quick fix for people with stereo systems.

????

[C.Wolf]

Osamede,
The yamaha sounds great. I have used it for 5 years now and am still impressed with how good it performs for its silly price tag. Im obviously not saying that a much more expensive processor wont sound better, but the heading said "Cheap but not nasty processor" and in my opinion this fits the bill perfectly. The fact that im using it in an expensive hifi system and it still shines should say it all.
Clyde

[JudgeBaxter]

I don't think you will do any better than this to be honest

http://www.canterburyhifi.co.uk/HiFiPage3.shtml

Also - when they say ex-dem, this is actually Rotel's own ex-dem rather than the shops i.e. the units have maybe been used once or twice only at a trade show or something, or been in the back of a rep's car and shown to dealers etc.

I wasn't sure I believed this speil, but went ahead anyway...

I very recently had a 1098 and 1075 amp off them - they did me a deal as I was having the pair - absolutely ludicrous value for money, and the two units that I got - I'd bet my house they had never even been out of the box before......totally mint and with a full 2 year warranty as well.

I think you'd have to do exceptionally well/and or be very lucky to get anything better overall for the price.

I'm stunned by my 1098. I briefly owned a 1068 beforehand which is great and at full RRP - I'd say save the £1.3K and stick with a 1068 as the difference is not really worth the £1.3K. But when the difference is only £500 quid (or under £400 in my case as I brought an amp as well and got a 'deal'), then the 1098 is arguably the way to go and should/could last you years....with or without fangled HDMI...

Hope this helps.

Best Regards,

David.

[foghorn]

Have to disagree with the earlier observation on the Yamaha DSP-E800.

My first entry into Home cinema was with Kenwood, later on I upgraded to the Yamaha DSP- 492 / Yamaha DDP-2 combo a big improvement on the Kenwood. When the Yamaha DSP-E800 was released I decided to go for the one box solution, however given that the price at £300 was half the price of the Yamaha 492/DDP-2 combo I had some reservations. I should not have worried the DSP-E800 moved my system up another league in terms sound quality.

I still have the DSP-E800 connected up to my Audiolab and have no real urge to change.

The next test will be perhaps the purchase of a Toshiba HD-DVD player.

Foghorn

[Liam @ Prog AV]

One would assume a processor made to be brand new at around £400-£500 would not be constructed of the best quality parts and would so be detrimental to the use of expensive amplification such as the NAP175 (which is only a 3ch BTW, I assume you already have 2ch system you are upgrading?).

For example, I tested a Denon 4306 as a processor to GEnelec active speakers, and compared to Arcam AVP700 (both using unbalanced for fairer test). The difference was absolutely, positively night and day. And that's a £1,500 integrated AV receiver so one would expect of the same kind of performance as your target £400-£500 processor.

All seems daft to me. Can you not take something like an Arcam AVR280 @ £1,200 rrp, and run pre-outs to your stereo amp?

[Tag user]

How about a previously cherished Tag McLaren audio av32r as a suggestion

[Bassbin]

I've got a budget processor in my ad here:

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=521589

Not had much interest so far so would welcome an offer. It would certainly do the job and then you could bide your time. You may find the prices of highend processors start to fall very quickly in coming months for new formats on the horizon.