Parasound advice - next step

[DeadEye]

I now have a Parasound C2 and A52 setup (thanks dts_boy) and I want to extend it to 7.1 (or more)

I have the option of buying an A21 (250Wx2) or another A52 (125Wx5) for about the same price.

So my options are:

Buythe other A52 and attempt to bi-amp the front three and use the remaining two channels to give me 7.1 or

Buy the A21 and simply by-wire the front L/R.

My questions to the forum therefor are apart from the "Which way would you guys go" question:

1) Is the A21 a better quality sounding amp as well as being twice the power
?
2) Can/Should I use the programmable unbalanced outputs on the processor to provide the two extra bi-amped channels?

2.5) should I apply the processors x-over to the above axtra channels?

3) Will having double the power going to the front L/R and not the center cock things up (even after doing a level calibration)?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Phil

Were I in your position I'd go for another A52 and bi-amp the front 3 speakers. The A21/51 is an absolute beast of an amp, but then again I have difficult to drive speakers.

From what I have read, the Dali Ikon range are not a difficult load for an amp. I share your concerns about the centre channel not receiving the same power if you used an A21 for the L/R channels. Biamping your Ikons would provide plenty of drive IMO. Both amps are designed by John Curl.

Just my two penneth worth.


BTW member LEON has both the A51 and A52 IIRC, you could maybe fire him a PM for his advice.

[Tag user]

. . .yes if you have split x-over designs then multi-amp the front three. . .can you not get a home demo? . .just to confirm the merits of such a configuration? . . .so many people seem to dismiss the Parasound Halo range of power amps without even hearing them!!! silly move in my opinion. . .those who have heard them rarely tend to disagree that the performance can be incredible. . .let us know which direction you take. . .

[DeadEye]

Not sure what you mean by split x-over, but from what I have read of the C2 manual, I can program up to four extra pre-outs to be what I want - including percentages of other channels included and x-over frequency.

I would probably send full range to the lower frequencies of the fronts just using the Front outputs and program the other outputs to cut-off the lower frequencies.

The way I saw it was either way the fronts will get around 250+Watts each (or more as I think my Dali's are 6ohm) but was wondering if the A21 would be better quality - better than the merrits of bi-amping.

[DeadEye]

Just to add to the complication, i don't seem to be able to bi-amp.

There are only two programmable outputs and I can't find how to configure these.

The A52's don't have an "out" allowing you to chain amps together so if I want to bi-amp then I am goin to have to use some sort of splitter - I can't emagine that's a good idea is it?

Oh dear...

[leon]

hiya thx for the pm not sure i can help much ..
i am using the a21 for the ex/es and the a51 for the other five channels ..i have them all balanced which is a bit of a downer when u upgrade you need 4 pairs of xlr
i have found the a21 keeps up well with the a51 i think the tricky bit is balancing all the channels .. like distance/etc the "mic" and c2 program does a fair job but it does need a bit of tweeking
in the c2 i have them all set to LARGE.. even the rear centres im playing around with the programmable parts of the c2 trying to run the 3 subs that i have .. i have the centre sub running well on {vocal base } and the other subs running normal using the LFE ..

Using splitter is absolutely fine. I had some high quality Chord cables specially made (one RCA to 2RCA) and to my ears there is no audible loss of quality (well it is better because I am bi-amping) compared to single RCA and single amping.

I'd check with Parasound that you can get a full signal out of the C2 when doing this.

Edit: Just realised you are using balanced connections - so you will definitely need to check if this is possible.

[DeadEye]

Originally Posted by jackal

Using splitter is absolutely fine. I had some high quality Chord cables specially made (one RCA to 2RCA) and to my ears there is no audible loss of quality (well it is better because I am bi-amping) compared to single RCA and single amping.

I'd check with Parasound that you can get a full signal out of the C2 when doing this.

Edit: Just realised you are using balanced connections - so you will definitely need to check if this is possible.

Acually I am currently using the un-balanced connections due to excessive hiss from my Nordest Balanced XLR's

[leon]

Originally Posted by DeadEye

Acually I am currently using the un-balanced connections due to excessive hiss from my Nordest Balanced XLR's

wow u as well i am getting hissing that i never had before .after changing my black rhodium xlr with chord anthems xlr .. i disconnected everything and it not the amp its the c2 its quite anoying at the moment the sound is better but on the quite scenes in films ,
i can here the hissing i was told by my local hifi shop its also because the speakers a accurate at 98db ..i am going to email parasound and see if they have any ideas chord told be they can modify the leadsfor free which i am guessing means they disconnect the earth at one end . but im not sure which way to go with the problem ..

[DeadEye]

Originally Posted by leon

wow u as well i am getting hissing that i never had before .after changing my black rhodium xlr with chord anthems xlr .. i disconnected everything and it not the amp its the c2 its quite anoying at the moment the sound is better but on the quite scenes in films ,
i can here the hissing i was told by my local hifi shop its also because the speakers a accurate at 98db ..i am going to email parasound and see if they have any ideas chord told be they can modify the leadsfor free which i am guessing means they disconnect the earth at one end . but im not sure which way to go with the problem ..

hmmm

let me know how you go with that. Chaning the earth to "lift" makes no difference for me so i am not sure it's an earthing thing. Do you find that is mailny affected by the center channel? All channels hiss for me but the center is the worst.

I am using some Digial Video interconnects (I know) that I used to use for componant video and it is deadly silent.

For interest I have decided to go the A21 route as I couldn't see a sensible way of bi-amping the A52's. The A51's have an output for this purpose the A52's don't. Using a splitter just doesn't sound like a good idea and the only other option was using XLR for one half of the front speakers and RCA for the other. This also didn't sound like a good idea along with the fact that switching from XLR to RCA there is a significant difference in volume - this could of course be because I am using the wrong interconnects.

Also the 51 and the 21 seem much better quality. The A21 comes tomorrow.

We shall see!

[bolts]

Originally Posted by DeadEye

For interest I have decided to go the A21 route as I couldn't see a sensible way of bi-amping the A52's. The A51's have an output for this purpose the A52's don't. Using a splitter just doesn't sound like a good idea and the only other option was using XLR for one half of the front speakers and RCA for the other. This also didn't sound like a good idea along with the fact that switching from XLR to RCA there is a significant difference in volume - this could of course be because I am using the wrong interconnects.

Sorry if it's a stupid question but what did you mean "The A51's have an output for this purpose" as I was not too keen on the idea of the splitter either. I have had a quick look through the manual on-line but did not see anything.

Originally Posted by bolts

Sorry if it's a stupid question but what did you mean "The A51's have an output for this purpose" as I was not too keen on the idea of the splitter either. I have had a quick look through the manual on-line but did not see anything.

They don't (I have the A51). There is nothing wrong with using split phono leads BTW, and is often the only way to bi-amp.

[bolts]

OK looks like I will need to get some splitter cables made up. I only asked because my monoblocks do have a pass-through for bi-amping and I couldn't see anything like that in the doc's for the A51. Does look like the A51 is the way to go though.

[leon]

Originally Posted by DeadEye

hmmm

let me know how you go with that. Chaning the earth to "lift" makes no difference for me so i am not sure it's an earthing thing. Do you find that is mailny affected by the center channel? All channels hiss for me but the center is the worst.

I tried the lift as well but it doesn’t help .also I have has a new earth cable sunk into the ground and I use a mains conditioner with chord power leads.. hehe still get that hiss tho
it’s mainly out the 4 main speakers ..The centre is ok and the ex/es are very quite.. So it’s a weird setup.. I didn’t have them with the cheaper rhodium leads. I disconnected the c2 from the amp and the hissing goes and then put 5 of the xlr leads back in with no other connections rca leads and it came back .. So the noise is coming from the c2 even with nothing connected..
my friend at the hifi shop said it all part of the game
some of there systems are around 40 grand and still they get hissing
so i can either put back the old cables and have a worse sound or use the good ones with hissing .
there is one thing I have not done in a while is blast the system flat out for a few hours to see if I get any changes sounds extreme but I cant think of what else to do ..

Why not try a few Russ Andrews Silencers on home trial around your system (and the house) to see if they make any difference.