Denon AVC-A1XVA - Upconversion/scaling

[chambeaj]

Hi,

Have any AVC-A1XV(A) owners here made use of the up-conversion/scaling facilities on their Denon ?

The reason I ask is summarised as follows:

(1) I am thinking of purchasing a Panasonic PH9 plasma panel.
(2) Normally I prefer to use my main AV system only when listening to music CDs/SACDs and watching DVDs. I prefer to use the TV's own speakers for general TV and week night Sky movie viewing.
(3) However, I am not certain that Panasonics plasma speakers, driven by the PH9 panels internal audio amp, will give an acceptable level of sound quality, even for everyday general TV!!
(4) Consequently, I may have to consider using my main sound system (Denon/KEF) all the time.
(5) This would mean I'll start to make use of the video features on the Denon, which up-until-now I have not made use of. Basically I bought the Denon for its audio prowess i.e. one-box-solution which produces awesome sound quality for movies and imho music.

(6) The intention would be that the Denon would have a single HDMI connection to the panel.
(7) Output from the Denon DVD-A1XVA would simply be switched/passed through.
(8) Output from the Sky+ box (i.e. PAL 576i S-Video, or YUV by way of JS Technology RGB SCART to YUV box) would be upconverted by the Denon to 720p over HDMI.

My question is, how good is the upconversion/de-interlacing/scaling on the Denon, and how will it compare with using a dedicated video processor such as the iScan VP50 ?

Any comments would be appreciated.

[Jase]

I use my A1XV to convert the S-Video signal from Sky+ to Component which it then scales to 1080i. This looks just as good as the Crystalio video processor I had and better than the two Lumagen's (Vision & Vision Pro S) I had previously.

Doubt if it will compete with the Iscan VP50 though. Not seen one of those in action as yet, but by all accounts it's excellent.

[chambeaj]

Originally Posted by Jase

I use my A1XV to convert the S-Video signal from Sky+ to Component which it then scales to 1080i. This looks just as good as the Crystalio video processor I had and better than the two Lumagen's (Vision & Vision Pro S) I had previously.

Doubt if it will compete with the Iscan VP50 though. Not seen one of those in action as yet, but by all accounts it's excellent.

Many thanks for your comments.

Much appreciated.

Sounds like buying a VP50 just to process the Sky+ output would be overkill. Your comments suggest that the Denon will do a more than admirable job (I would hope so given how much it cost), and bettering the weak internal processing on the PH9. The PH9 is supposed to be an excellent panel so long as its fed with a quality progressive signal (internal de-interlacer/scaler is nothing special according to reviews).

I know how stunning the AVC-A1XV(A) is with regards to audio, and I know how awesome the DVD-A1XV(A) is with regards to picture quality, but not having used the Denon Amps video processing features, I just wanted some re-assurance as to the quality of the end result (which you have now given me).

Thank you for your help
Regards
Adrian

p.s. In case you are wondering, I cannot currently test the up-conversion feature for myself as I do not currently have a display. In fact, I've not had a display for a few months, something which I hope to correct within the coming two weeks.

[Jase]

The only niggle is some macroblocking thanks to the Faroudja chip but half the Sky channels show this so it's tricky to tell whether it's chip or source sometimes. Panasonic displays are the worst for showing it (I have a PWD6). Decent channels like C4 or C5 can look superb though and I certainly don't miss my Video Processor's at all.

You are limited to the fixed resolutions that the Denon outputs so you have to take that into consideration as well. But in terms of setup it's a doddle, press the Video Scaler button, select Resolution and you're done.

You won't be getting the sort of image that your DVD-A1XVA can produce though so don't expect that!

[Jase]

Just one more thing. 1080i looks better than 720p into my panel, it's slightly sharper but without any ringing whereas 720p looks softer.

[chambeaj]

Originally Posted by Jase

The only niggle is some macroblocking thanks to the Faroudja chip but half the Sky channels show this so it's tricky to tell whether it's chip or source sometimes. Panasonic displays are the worst for showing it (I have a PWD6). Decent channels like C4 or C5 can look superb though and I certainly don't miss my Video Processor's at all.

You are limited to the fixed resolutions that the Denon outputs so you have to take that into consideration as well. But in terms of setup it's a doddle, press the Video Scaler button, select Resolution and you're done.

You won't be getting the sort of image that your DVD-A1XVA can produce though so don't expect that!

Thanks.

Can I just ask, are you saying that Panasonic panels exaggerate macro-blocking and make it worse (i.e. some undesirable attribute of their internal processing) ?

I ask because I still have a nagging concern about the Panasonic panels with regards to issues such as colour-banding/macro-blocking.

For instance, this review at Audioholics - the blocking in the scenes from 'V for Vendetta'.

http://www.audioholics.com/productre...-50PH9UKp3.php

I've still not managed to ascertain if its the source, or if it is the Panasonic displays on-board processing which is responsible (i.e. blocky blue background). I have seen displays (i.e. Philips 9731) showing this kind of picture fault, and it was definitely not down to the source i.e. the panels on-board processing was introducing the artifacts (even when fed with a quality DVD title from a reference player such as the Denon DVD-A1XVA). Same DVD and same player would yield stunning picture quality, devoid of artifacts, on another model of display (and wow, the DVD-A1XV(A) certainly produces the most awesome DVD picture quality I have ever seen ).

I very much prefer the overall picture quality on the Panasonic plasmas (based on viewings of the PX600), but very wary these days, as I experienced a few panels this year which had undesirable picture processing faults. And if there are two things I really hate, its macro-blocking and posterisation/colour banding.

Thank you in advance for any advice.

[chambeaj]

By the way, I'm seriously impressed with the audio quality on the AVC-A1XVA (both music and film). Even the internet streaming radio sounds great

[Jase]

Originally Posted by chambeaj

Can I just ask, are you saying that Panasonic panels exaggerate macro-blocking and make it worse (i.e. some undesirable attribute of their internal processing) ?

I ask because I still have a nagging concern about the Panasonic panels with regards to issues such as colour-banding/macro-blocking.

For instance, this review at Audioholics - the blocking in the scenes from 'V for Vendetta'.

http://www.audioholics.com/productre...-50PH9UKp3.php

I've still not managed to ascertain if its the source, or if it is the Panasonic displays on-board processing which is responsible (i.e. blocky blue background). I have seen displays (i.e. Philips 9731) showing this kind of picture fault, and it was definitely not down to the source i.e. the panels on-board processing was introducing the artifacts (even when fed with a quality DVD title from a reference player such as the Denon DVD-A1XVA). Same DVD and same player would yield stunning picture quality, devoid of artifacts, on another model of display (and wow, the DVD-A1XV(A) certainly produces the most awesome DVD picture quality I have ever seen ).

The Panasonic's definitely exaggerate macroblocking if it's present and mine suffers from posterisation/colour banding. As to whether they introduce macroblocking into the equation themselves, that's tricky. I have the DVD-A1XVA as well and it's ruthless for showing up any duff sources/mastering. Feed the panel a well mastered disc and it won't show macroblocking but you will see posterisation/banding in some scenes. I've ordered the DVI blade to see if that helps with banding at all.

I'll have to take another look at V for Vendetta and see if that scene shows macroblocking. Could be difficult as it's a foggy scene which will be posterising and colour banding like mad...

I use my AVC-A11XVA to scale non-HD material from a SKY HD box, to 1080i and now find the scaler better than that on my Pioneer panel or the HD box itself. Agree with Jase though that it is far better at 1080i (allowing the panel to de-interlace and scale back) than at 720p.