Experiences with Professional Calibrators

[BruceH]

I am very close to calling in a calibrator to setup my projection and my audio.
However it is a significant amount of money and I would hate to be disappointed.

Please could somebody post their experience with any of these professionals.

Thanks,
Bruce.

[Pecker]

Anyone with a sound level meter and a DVE disc can calibrate their own audio levels - it's cheap and fun.

Sound reflections in the room are a different matter.

For the picture, I think an ISF calibration would probably be worthwhile, but I wouldn't bother with anyone non-ISF. They might be good, but they set ups installers have done for me have not been as good as I've managed myself from DVE, and I'm a novice.

Steve W

[BruceH]

I'm thinking more along the lines of

* reflections
* flattening the frequency spectrum

and for the picture, yes I've used DVE and Avia, but I'm never quite happy with my own judgement.

[Gary Lightfoot]

For correct greyscale calibration you need the proper equipment, and it's not something that most people can do without the tools or knowledge, so for calibration to D65 you'll need more than DVE. For basic black and white level settings and setting saturation, a test disk will let you do that.

Gordon gets good feedback and has a lot of experience and knowledge, so I'd reccomend him.

Gary

[BruceH]

sorry for theignorance, haven't been around that long here.

Gordon ??

[Gary Lightfoot]

Sorry - Gordon Fraser of Convergent AV

Forum name: Gordon @ Convergent AV

Website:

http://www.convergent-av.co.uk/

There are others (Piers and Chris Frost as well as the avdoctor people come to mind). It might be worth having a chat with them to see who seems best for you. Travelling adds to the bill, so someone closer may be cheaper.

HTH

Gary

[weyland-yutani]

sorry if this sounds dumb, but what is "ISF calibration"? what does it stand for/mean and what does it/they do?

is it to do with the engineers menu on tv's?

again, sorry if these are simplistic questions.

[Gary Lightfoot]

ISF means Imaging Science Foundation and is the name of a company who run the calibration courses and issue the certificates:

http://www.imagingscience.com/

There are two types of certificate, those with calibration kit and those without.

Gary

[Neil Davidson]

Maybe I can step in here without feeling that I am hijacking the thread too much ;)

As Gary has pointed out the ISF organisation supplies training and consultancy designed to ensure that displays of all types produce the most accurate images possible.

There are various standards for reproduction of recorded content specified by organisations like SMPTE and the EBU that describe exactly how the display should be configured to ensure that what is on the screen in your home matches what the director intended when creating the movie.

Using test patterns and analysis tools we are able to adjust the display so that it matches these standards as closely as possible. Obviously not every display has every control required or the number of memories required to set every source independantly but I have yet to find a display that was not dramatically improved by calibration - from the cheapest LCD to projectors costing £100k plus!

Just to correct one thing - there is only one certificate as you have either been trained for ISF or you haven't. There are however seperate listings for those who have invested in the correct calibration equipment and those who haven't. If you want to have a calibration performed then you should of course seek the services of someone who has the tools for the job.

HTH

Neil

[Gary Lightfoot]

Hi Neil,

Thanks for that clarification. Is it posible to fail the ISF course? Just curious.

Gary

[Neil Davidson]

Hi Gary,

To get the certificate you must pass a lengthy exam comprising multiple choice and essay style questions. You do get a couple of attempts and extra coaching if you fail the first time but you could still fail. A surprisingly large percentage of those who take the course do not take the exam at the end and of course do not become certified!

It is also worth noting that the ISF in Europe is now somewhat distinct from the ISF in the US. Tom Vanthuyne who teaches the course in Europe has gone to great lengths to ensure that the material is as relevant as possible to techs this side of the pond. For example the correct method to calibrate for NTSC and PAL on the same system isn't much of a worry to the US guys! This of course also means that the European test differs from the US test.

Neil

[Steve Collier]

So if one wants to know who is ISF-certified in a European country, is it the same or a different website to that already cited? Thanks

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

The ISF website listed should have everyone who's done the course and passed the test. Of course that will not tell you who is experienced or competent. A search of this site and others for ISF calibration might help get some answers. There have been numerous threads over the last few years on here about this service. I have just clicked on this thread and at top and bottom there are adverts for two folk offering the service. My add hasn't come up but then, you can't have everything......

Gordon

[Wilbur]

Hi all,

Can any system benefit from this kind of professional audio visual calibration?

I've just completed a new set up and was toying with the idea but didn't know whether I would need to have bought a system at 4 or 5 times the price to really experience significant benefits. What's more, while I've been careful to take lots of advice along the way (both on the forums and from installers) my worst nightmare would be being told - "if only you had those in-walls installed 3 inches higher"!

Here's the set up... and does anybody know of any good practitioners in North London?

Fujitsu P50XHA58
Arcam AVR200 (old faithful!)
Arcam DV88 Plus (old faithful!)
Sky HD
B&W in-wall Fronts: CCM Cinema, 2 x CCM800s
B&W in-ceiling rears: 2 x CCM65s

Thank you,

Will

[Gary Lightfoot]

I think that it would be very rare for any video display to be correctly calibrated to D65 out of the box (Infocus projectors may be the exception), but how far from ideal it would be can vary quite a bit and so how much improvement can be gained visualy can vary too. It could be said that a cheaper display would need more calibration than a more expensive one, but I think Gordon has calibrated more than his fair share of high end kit as well.

Audio may also need accoustic treatments for better results and that's another field of expertise. Matty on the forum can give some idea of what may be needed by using your room dimensions, but basic speaker set-up with a sound meter can be done without it.

Gary

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Wilbur: It is against forum rules for any calibrators to answer your question directly. May I suggest you look at the posters on the forum who are calibrators/retailers and also the forum sponsors list

Gordon

[Steve Collier]

If you look on http://www.imagingscience.com/isf-trained.cfm you should be able to find someone who is a certified ISF calibrator

[alwyn]

I see that av doctor is a certified isf and is as far as I know,the most reasonably priced, plus no travel charges. I was recently asked £275 plus travel that would have cost another £100. With the av doctor it says on his price list for a plasma £175 anyware in the uk with no travel charge.Sounds like he is the man for the job.

[Joe Fernand]

Hello alwyn

I'm pretty sure Neil (AV Doctor) is 175.00 GBP + 50.00 GBP per Source Device and a VP is treated as a Source device; so if you have SKY HD + VP + a Display its 275.00 GBP.

Different folk show calibration pricing in different ways and Neil appears to be following the ISF model of a 'basic' charge (175.00 GBP) to go on site, then a per Device to be calibrated charge.

I cant imagine anyone can afford to cover all corners of the UK at a fixed price of 175.00 GBP - I had a run down to Portsmouth last week and spent nigh on 160.00 GBP on Fuel alone.

Best regards

Joe

[alwyn]

Hello alwyn

I'm pretty sure Neil (AV Doctor) is 175.00 GBP + 50.00 GBP per Source Device and a VP is treated as a Source device; so if you have SKY HD + VP + a Display its 275.00 GBP.

Different folk show calibration pricing in different ways and Neil appears to be following the ISF model of a 'basic' charge (175.00 GBP) to go on site, then a per Device to be calibrated charge.

I cant imagine anyone can afford to cover all corners of the UK at a fixed price of 175.00 GBP - I had a run down to Portsmouth last week and spent nigh on 160.00 GBP on Fuel alone.

Best regards

Joe
Hello Joe,
Yes I see that there is a charge for input source but I had not thought that the sky box would be included in this,how could the plasma be calibrated without one? But conceeding that you are right,that still means only £225 for plasma plus sky box and as far as travel he clearly states no charge for travel and that they cover that in the whole of the uk.So I still think that he must be offering the lowest cost isf service in the country.
Best wishes
alwyn

[Joe Fernand]

Hello alwyn

There are lots of 'on-site' services we use in the AV and Consumer market and lots of them are priced as a 'get me on site' charge plus the 'work I'll do when I get on site' charges.

As you say Neil's pricing works out very reasonable if you have 1 x Source and 1 x Display - though personally I think he's nuts if he doesn't charge travel and covers the whole of the UK :)

The only way to make that work is to be doing calibrations 24/7 and never stay at home - not much of a life!!!

Best regards

Joe