Burn in is temporary?

[Stringfellow]

Got this from the Van Den Hul site:

'Cable burn-in is very positive, because you fundamentally weld parts together with “microbridges” not present before the burn-in. But as soon as you bend the cable by lifting it, you break them open again. So once you’ve burned-in the cable, don’t touch it — leave it as it is, because as soon as you move it, you break it open and must start again.'

Maybe I've seen this first hand! But I bet bending/moving is not as bad as a completely new cable. I'm sure this effect it subtle... But it means you have to burn in then listen, not swap over and back when comparing. Could be tedious.

[Nick_UK]

I think swallowing the snake oil becomes more tedious !

[deaf cat]

Yep I've noticed it, did not believe it untill I did what the dealer suggested, plug it in (demo cable, obviously I bend it differently to its previous shape) listened, left it on, went out for 4/5 hours, came back and yep it was better. Don't understand it myself. When I did buy it new, it needed a long long time to burn in to get the same result.

[JohnWH]

Obviously using wax as a transmission medium, holds the snake oil better

[Lawrenzini]

Of course it's only temparary... as soon as you realise it doesnt work you stop believing... abit like the toothfairy.

[Nick_UK]

You mean, like the Emperor's New Clothes Syndrome ?

[deaf cat]

So, just out of intrest then, do you guys use the bell wire freebie IC's?

[mr_seanstanley]

thats a good one.

[Nick_UK]

Originally Posted by mr_seanstanley

thats a good one.

Care to explain why ? Some "bell wire" is more than sufficient. What magical properties does expensive cable have over "bell wire" ? Technical terms please, not vague ones like grain and pure.

[mr_seanstanley]

just with regards to deaf cats comment. It tickled my funny bone. I am a believer in cables. Not going to get into a cable debate again but people that say its a load of rubbish usually have decent ones anyway. No magic involved, just science.
Take a look at http://www.hifi.org.uk/tech/
although you will probly think it all snake oil...

[Barton1967]

Originally Posted by mr_seanstanley

just with regards to deaf cats comment. It tickled my funny bone. I am a believer in cables. Not going to get into a cable debate again but people that say its a load of rubbish usually have decent ones anyway. No magic involved, just science.

There will always be cables that are inadequate i.e. too small a CSA to carry the required power or poorly shielded. The crucial point is to choose cables based on specific requirements rather than bad science or 'expensive is better' beliefs.

Originally Posted by mr_seanstanley

Take a look at http://www.hifi.org.uk/tech/
although you will probly think it all snake oil...

But they make cables to sell. Hardly the most unbiased opinion.

I love this from the running in section:

There's no obvious reason for this, but it's possible that cable characteristics change as they approach ambient room temperature, or as the dielectric tends towards a 'steady residual polarisation state'

[Nick_UK]

Originally Posted by mr_seanstanley

Take a look at http://www.hifi.org.uk/tech/
although you will probly think it all snake oil...

It's not snake-oil - it's a site which claims to be technical, but runs out of steam in every paragraph, e.g.....

Tough Pitch Copper (TPC) is the name given to unprocessed copper: the type usually employed in general purpose cabling such as power leads and many inexpensive audio cables. TPC is melted once and formed into a cylindrical conductor (wire) which is then allowed to cool. This wire is then repeatedly drawn to reduce it to the desired diameter.

TPC contains somewhere between 300 and 500 ppm of oxygen and other impurities, which is considered far too high for serious audio applications. When used as speaker cables, mains power cables tend to cause a loss of fine detail resulting in a 'woolly' or dull sounding system. This is due to the TPC and also, in part, to the PVC insulation used in standard mains power cables.

Now, I'd be more inclined to believe it if they said why TPC gave a "wooly or dull" sound, or why PVC insulation does the same, but sadly they don't, and every paragraph is like that

[Stringfellow]

Originally Posted by mr_seanstanley

just with regards to deaf cats comment. It tickled my funny bone. I am a believer in cables. Not going to get into a cable debate again but people that say its a load of rubbish usually have decent ones anyway. No magic involved, just science.
Take a look at http://www.hifi.org.uk/tech/
although you will probly think it all snake oil...

Made me giggle too.

This is a darn good point... What hi-fi do the non-believers have (connected with the bell wire)?

[Nick_UK]

Why ? Do you want to add some snobbery into this already "wooly" thread ?

[Stringfellow]

But the kit is very important. It could be a reason why some say they hear no difference - could be issue resolved. My kit isn't fantasic:

This very day:

Acoustic Energy Aelite 3 speakers
Musical Fidelity A3 integrated amp
Musical Fidelity A3.24 DAC
Orelle CD10T transport
Kimber Silver streak (amp-dac) 1m
Van den Hul First metal shield (trans-dac) 1m
QED Silver Anniversary speaker cable 2x 4m bi-wire

It's all second hand, so I'm far from a yuppie am I...