DVD Recorder muddle

[malcom]

Having read about the arival of DVD recorders being iminent. The Philips in a couple of weeks and a Panasonic machine around Oct.

I searched the web for details and found plenty of info on the philips DVD recorder but nothing about the Panasonic.

I e-mailed Panasonic for info and about when to expect to see them here in the UK.

There reply was that there is no machine planned in the near future for the UK.

I then read in the Home Cinema mag that a Panasonic DVD recorder should arrive here in the UK around October this year. The model number was included and the Home Cinema Mag have done a limited revue on a sample machine that was provided.

I e-mailed Panasonic again to see if they could clarify the conflicting facts.

Their Reply. None at all.

Will Panasonic let Philips get a hold of the DVD recorder market by not shipping a machine any time in the near future. I cannot believe they can be that mad.

I also phone JVC UK to ask about there likely plans for a DVD recorder. They denied any knowledge about the fact that there are at least three different DVD recorder formats coming out. They could not state which format they would be producing because as far as they new there was only one format. What a load of tosh.

[Starburst]

Are Panasonic part of the DVD consortium that would explain why they don't remote hackable dvd players and might explain why no details are emerging since they are still in a bit of a format war. Phillips are jumping the gun with a different standard which isn't part of the DVD consortium in the hopes of establishing a market for their system.

[malcom]

Sorry Kevo but your logic is illogical.

An analog tuner puts out vhs quality? I don't know what equipment you have? Please tell so that it can be avoided!

The picture quality I get from my analog TV tuner is fine. The same cannot always be said for some of the channels from a digital tuner.

Whatever the quality of the output from whatever type of tuner it will be further degraded by the limits of the VHS technology. 240 lines compared to 500+ with DVD or D-VHS.

Yes it would be convenient to have a digital tuner as well as analog tuner built into a DVD recorder. Do you know of any VHS recorder with a digital tuner?

[Kevo]

I don't know much about this model but one thing I do know is, that it has an analog tuner !!!

Surely this is a mistake.

That's like having a DVD player that can only ouput in VHS quality.

Anyone forking out £1300 for this needs serious treatment !

[malcom]

Some 20 years ago I purchased the first generation Betamax recorder for £800. Someone has to be mad enough:-). So I suppose 20 years on and loads of inflation you could argue that £1300 is a bargain! The straight jacket still fits as well:-).

As tempting as Recordable DVD is I don't think I could justify or sensibly afford the £1300 price tag. when they become about £800 then temptation would really set in. £500 and I would be out the door like a shot and buy a dozen.:-)

[Ars longa, vita brevis]

[quote]Originally posted by Confucius:<br /><strong>As an aside I don't feel £1300 is unreasonable for a 1st gen machine of this sort. I bought a 1st gen Nicam VCR back in '87 (£800), and a 1st gen S-VHS deck in '91 (£800 too!).

.</strong><hr></blockquote>

cant help feeling a bit ripped off now looking back?

or are you still ok with magnetic tape?

[Kevo]

Thanks Confucious, that's exactly what I was getting at.

No Malcom, I don't know of any VHS recorder that has a digital tuner. Don't you feel there should be?

Yes I agree that they should come with a dual analog/digital tuner like the new IDTVs.

[MartinImber]

I think DVD+RW will be an early sucess simply due to being back compatable.

I paid £800 for a Beta deck 12 years ago it's only worth about £500 now <img src="frown.gif" border="0">

[malcom]

How soon the DVD+RW will reduce in price will I think depend on how soon it has competition. I.e. In the form of DVD-RW and DVD RAM. I fear prices won’t reduce for quite some time as it appears to be less than clear if competition will be strong in the near future.

The reason I say that is because I recently e-mailed Panasonic who have been reported in the Magazines to be releasing their first DVD-RAM machine in the UK around October.

Panasonics reply to me was that they have no plans in the near future to release a DVD-Recorder. I have re-emailed Panasonic and the Mag that has reported the October release probability. There is a deafening silence from Panasonic. No reply this time! The mag e-mail was only recent and am still hoping for some clarification.

As I said before if there is no competition then I think prices will remain high for the foreseeable future. The price of D-VHS remained high for a long time. Even now after more than a year the cost of a D-VHS machine ranges from the £1300 down to around £700. Regards. Malcom

[Ars longa, vita brevis]

[quote]Originally posted by Confucius:<br /><strong><br /> Sure, they'll be replaced eventually; one with a TiVo 'type' HDD recorder, the other by a DVD+RW deck.

I archive nothing more on tape now anyway, most of my favorite TV shows are now, or soon to be, available on DVD. That which isn't will be transfered from tape to disc by me when the prices come down. The DV to MPEG conversion and NTSC record capability are pretty much essential for me too, reckon I'll take the plunge with the Philips later this year.

[ 11-09-2001: Message edited by: Confucius ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

<br />philps one, may i ask why, i am also pretty confused by the differnet formats.

i thought the panasonic one in hcc looked quite good as you can record to a normal dvd to be played in any player and also to dvd-ram for tivo capability, pausing tv etc.

what does the philips one have to offer, dvd=rw i believe. i have to say, whilst tying not to sound snobbish that i have always believed philips to be at the lowere end of the market compared to say sony or pioneer or panasonic etc. In saying that however i have heard some good reviews of philips stuff and many products use philips components.

[malcom]

I agree with your conclusions about DVD-RAM as of this moment. I have read though that some future DVD players may well be able to play DVD-RAM discs. Future Hitachi players I believe?

One comment from a Mag reviewer which at the moment puts me off DVD-RAM was that the top quality picture setting was only near DVD quality.

I don't think a DVD-Recorder would be worth it's salt if it can't at least match typical DVD quality.

<a href="http://www.qed-uk.com" target="_blank">www.qed-uk.com</a> had the Panasonic DVD recordable listed at £831 and the Phillips at £1048. This is a reputable site that I bought my 36in widescreen TV from. Anyone tempted?

cant see the point with DVD Recorders at the moment.

To get a decent amount of storage at a decent bit rate you need a damn site more than the 4.7gb that a single layer DVDR will offer.

The price per hour of storage is frightening, and combine this with no single standard and you have a recipe for disaster.

I'm more than happy with my DVHS decks - great quality and 17.25 hours of storage for the price of a pro grade SVHS tape - £6.50

For recordings off commercial channels I can record at the high 14.1 mbps bit rate off air and then dub down to 4.3 (to cut ads etc)with practically no difference in quality. And for BBC channels the 4.3 rate is excellent.

You can get the JVC model for £700 now so I'd urge anyone who needs lots of storage or who has a large VHS/SVHS collection to switch to DVHS.

For my needs (can't afford DV) - the perfect format.

[malcom]

True. DVDR is not cost effective at the moment. That could soon change however!

I have considered D-VHS as a temp alternative and the problem is as far as I am concerned I don't believe D-VHS has any realistic future and therfore could end up with a pile of stuff archived to a format that no longer has machines on the market.

As for the format war with DVDR. That is not a major problem as long as DVD players are available for the forseable future. It seems that at least two of the formats will allow the playing of their recorded disks on most ordinary DVD players. Also the DVD-RAM format DVD-R disks once finalized can also play on normal DVD players.

A problem would arise if normal DVD players were replaced only by DVDR's and recordings from each others machines were still not compatible.

I somehow think that DVD players will be around much longer than the expected life span of the coming batch of different format DVDR's.

[malcom]

Ken S wrote..

<a href="http://www.qed-uk.com" target="_blank">www.qed-uk.com</a> had the Panasonic DVD recordable listed at £831 and the Phillips at £1048. This is a reputable site that I bought my 36in widescreen TV from. Anyone tempted?

<br />Reply...

Thank's for the link. Very tempting! It just goes to show the flexibility range of pricing that is possible already.