BETA: Homemade Greyscreen result

[Paul D]

I've just painted my screen (new plastered wall) with a grey paint. I got four match pots of variable shades of grey. I painted each shade in a quarter of the screen and left a square in the middle brilliant white. I found the darkest grey (no3) no use at all as it did give perfect blacks but in space scenes etc the faint stars also disappeared!. The lightest grey shade (no6) was fine for leaving brightness alone (although it did still darken whites) but didn't really make much difference to blacks. It did however help contrast in depth of the picture ie things didn't look as washed out. The next darkest shade of grey (no5) looked excellent on blacks also you could see most stars, etc. But it subdued whites a little to much. I compromised by mixing the lightest (no6) with the next darkest ( no5) and found this to be my ideal. You may find this to be to dark/light etc. After watching with a grey screen for a while with no white screen to compare, whites are more than exceptable due to the blacks looking so much better! ie contrast range. I have read about other people saying it gives a more 3D look (picture depth) and it is amazing!!!. Dark films were a pain and to be avoided ( aka pitch black etc). Even wild wild west is un - i say unbelievable!. Sorry for all the !! marks but it makes that much difference. People may have to use a primer first etc then use the paint listed below:

DULUX ICE STORM No5 00nn 53/00
DULUX ICE STORM No6 00nn 72/00
These are matt emulsions

Then just mix in equal quantities. :PAUL: (Tested with MT1z -700 ansi)

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I'am not drinking anymore....but i'am not drinking any less

[ROne]

I have now finished my screen based on your advice
and it has made a big difference. I followed your
instructions and found that I coulf get away with
a shade darker still and so mixed 4 with 5 for the
final couple of coats.

It looks superb, no wonder people don't follow this
logic, most screens seem to be white and these are
not good LCD maxium contrast.

I have a seven foot screen 4:3, and sit about 11 foot back,
I have fastened the projector to an AVF television bracket
which fits spot on.

The projector is located above my head and is placed upside
down so I can get the throw lower to the floor without peoples
heads in the way. (I don't know if you have had this problem).

I'm thinking about carpeting the walls, I have done this in my office
at work and its several properties, its warmer, darker and sound absorbant.
I don't know yet because I am taking over my girlfriends house ....

Grateful, ROne.

[Paul D]

I've nearly finished my dedicated cinema room. And i have just started thinking colour schemes. I have put pillars on the side walls about every 30 inches or so (to help with sound waves etc)and was going to paint the walls a dark red shade. But sod it i've decided to paint the wall black with a space horizon type scene (stars/galaxys etc). Should look great after a couple of pints!!. I have already put a black felt suspended ceiling up. I'am hoping to finish the room by next friday so i can spend the weekend enjoying films/flightsim/f1 Racing!. I have done all the building work myself to keep cost down. £3500 approx upto now including all equipment (projector-DVD etc)and building materials. If i never see a piece of MDF again i will be a happy man!. I'am photo-ing each stage and i hope to set up a web page to display(show off!)it, and to encourage other people to have a go.

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I'am not drinking anymore....but i'am not drinking any less

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Rone:

Most screens are white as the bulk of them were designed for use with CRT video projection and for use in high ambient light areas. CRT's have lower light outputs but can achieve extremely good black levels due to there physical operating characteristics. So, the ideal screen for CRT is White in colour.

LCD/DLP/DiLA can be extremely bright, but have great difficulty in producing black due to their physical operating characteristics. So, in order to help get black down to black their ideal screen would be "BLACK". Of course, you'd need a seriously bright projector to get any white......... So the ideal compromise as fulabeer and yourself have found is some form of grey screen. If done correctly you'll get better blacks and it'll still be bright enough to watch in a controlled light situation.

The contrast ratio from the projector isn't actually affected. It stays the same. However, as there is less light being reflected off the screen itself, the ambient light level in the room goes down as well resulting in a a greater contrast ratio for the whole viewing exerience as the picture looks less washed out. Does this make sense? or are folk lost?

All the best,

Gordon

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StereoStereo
Intelligent Solutions for Intelligent Homes !

[Metric]

rone, sames probs with peoples heads, the projector has to go behind the sofa so has to be a bit off the floor so i have to kinda dip it forward to throw down...removing keystone use. Im trying to find a way to hang my plus from the ceiling/high up and am intrigued with your bracket suggestion.

In addition...how do you guys line up the screen and the projector? projector first then screen?

cheers
Mike

[Gary Palmer]

Gordon,

I discovered a while back that my DLP projector produced a much better picture with the brightness level wound down much lower than when used for PC powerpoint applications.

I guess this achieves something similar to the grey screen.... instead of reflecting less I project less ?

If it's a true 'grey' screen it should not skew the colour balance so I imagine it has the same effect as reducing the projector brightness.

Am I losing the plot ?

[ROne]

Gordon, what you're saying makes complete sense, its just ashame that I think LCD projectors get an unfair crack of the whip because of people not knowing about the greyscreen improvement.

Metric.

I first tested various heights to mount the projector on the rear wall by stacking boxes until I got the optium height. I wanted to see the screen at eye level rather than lifting my head up.

I have turned the projector upside down so the lens throw is downwards, meaning you can get the height without keystone adjustment. And most importantly high enough to miss peoples heads. I believe it to be okay upside down becuaes it is intended for ceiling mount and you are not blocking any air vents (they are on the side).

When happy with the height, I projected a image onto the wall and in the dark masked of the image. I then painted in the colour as described by fullabeer. Removed the masking.

Going back to the projector I noted the height with a pen and spirit level. Attacthed the bracket to the wall and put the projector in place. I needed some sticky pads ( I used laminated floor protextors B&Q) to lift the projector to the correct height as it was out a fraction due to my poor drilling.

Voila. A more or less decent home cinema.

I am painting the room dark violet with red black out curtains for the windows... I'll let you know how i get on.

Thanks.

ROn.e

I got myself a AVF tv bracket from B&Q £9.99.

[This message has been edited by ROne (edited 08-01-2001).]

[Metric]

cheers, i dont have the ability to paint the wall as i have a fire place in the way, at the moment i have a roll screen that i pull down to view (though ive not viewed much coz of the hassle.

Im thinking of making a frame and cutting up te roll screen so i cam surround it in felt, i will then just hang this when i want to watch a movie.

My dad had a tv bracket, little bigger than my tiny plus but im going to use long full thread rods to attach it. Im gonna mount the bracket upside down...i want it as high and out of the way as possible...boxes...ingeneous

Hope we get to see pics of your setup when complete

Mike

[Paul D]

A vinyl floor type covering would be ideal but i imagine it would be hard to get the right shade of grey (but you never know!).I have read on the AVS forum about some people dying a white cotton (thick/smooth) bed sheet grey, and then stretching this over a wooden frame. Maybe this might be an alternative for you because of your fireplace. I have not finished my room yet (I always underestimate how long things take!)but i will post the pics on the web. Web address to follow on completion

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I'am not drinking anymore....but i'am not drinking any less

I have been reading this thread for a while now and am going to attempt to try a grey screen. I currently project onto white chippaper which is not ideal but does the job.
Two questions though:

1. Its obviously best to start off with light grey and work your way up to the darkest grey possible but what point am i looking to stop, whats a good picture to use to find out when to stop getting any darker?

2.Im still fairly new to this milarky, what is keystone? I have a sharp xv-710p lcd projector.

Cheers


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Maybe i`ll go to the movies.....by myself!!!

[ROne]

I think you're gonna have to experiment to find out what shade your happy with, look through recent posts to see fullabeer instructions, you need to get yourself to a B&Q to get a dulux mixing machine.

I reckon I could go one shade lower than I am, I have mixed ICESTORM 4 with 5, I think fullabeer did 5 with 6.

ROne.

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Keystone is the adjustment of the picture to change it from a trapezoid shape to rectangular when the projector is not installed at the ideal location.

Use something like Video Essentials "montage of images" section when you see the undersideof the road bridge. See if you can actually see the spans underneath. Also use other dark lit scenes, perhaps some Star Trek stuff.

I'd also go to the AVS web site at WWW.AVSFORUM.COM and see their screen forum. Ask what films produced the biggest difference with the Beta Stewart Greyhawck screen.

All the best


Gordon

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StereoStereo
Intelligent Solutions for Intelligent Homes !

[Richard Harnwell]

Thanks for the info fulabeer.

I spent the weekend projecting (Sony VW10HT) onto large bits of card painted with Ice Storm 5 & 6.

They do definately have the positive effects you outlined, but I'm wondering if there is a slight blue hue to both greys?

Has anyone else found this or is it just me seeing things?

Cheers,

Richard

[jamiebgp]

I'm also keeping a keen eye on this thread, I am so close to finishing my room and my LCD purchase is imminent, Either the Sanyo PLV30 or the NEC VT440. But do i really need to splash money on a screen. Would a roller blind do? if so what are the best and then how would i go about painting it grey, properly?
If this does indeed work, surley an electric roller blind is a hell of a lot cheaper than an electric screen.

Anyone

[Mr.D]

Originally posted by Gordon, StereoStereo:

Use something like Video Essentials "montage of images" section when you see the undersideof the road bridge.

Gordon

Alternatively use the snell and wilcox zone plate on VE and see if you can disclose the central area from the surround in the dark square on the right hand side.