How close is 708 to Cine7

[tryingtimes]

Okay - I been, I've seen, I've fallen in love.

I really liked the Cine7 setup at 'The Event'.Can someone please tell me how close I could get to that using a s/h 708, a cheaper screen, lower cost cabling, £400 dvd player/some kind of scaling solution or a HCPC?

Am I compromising in too many areas to come close or am I still going to get that silky smooth liquidity that we all saw in the CRT room that wasn't present in the Panel room?

Cheers

Alex

[Gordon @ Convergent AV]

Hi Alex,

The cabling wasn't that expensive I think....

I've seen 708's and I've now seen a good Cine7 installation. Roland is the man to give you technical answers on this. I'd guess you'll get an image you'll likely love. The colour accuracy will not be as good, I can say pretty much for definate.

If you get the chance see if you can arrange to see a 708 somewhere, then make up your mind. They made a few versions I believe.

Gordon

[Roland @ B4]

Alex

Short answer "very"

The Cine 7 was the next evoloution in the 700 series chaisis Which Barco introduced in Summer 1992 It is my belief it was their most successfull projector ever. The range/evolution went something like this.
BV700
BV701
BV701HQ
BV701s
BV701sHQ
BD701s
BV701mm
BV708
BV708mm
BD708

I have the dates if you are bothered.The most important two changes where introduction of the "s" versions which meant it could do component video and the intro of the 708 which gave it nearly an 8" tube.

Now on to the differences between a cine 7 and 708.

Cine7 has colour filtered lenses to improve satuataion and colour fringing.C7 has RGB and seperate H & V inputs for PC.708 only had combined sync input.Bandwidth for component video improved in the C7.The C7 is compatiable with BArco's New LiMo pro which gives you access to Line trippling ie 700 lines which is ideal for a 7" CRT.The remote system on C7 was changed to RC5 from PPM which made it easier to use with learing remotes.C7 has a new front end menu

If you are condidering HTPC either the BD708 or BV708mm is the minimum you should consider due to restictions in scan frequencies.

Non of the cabling we used at "The Event" was partitularly special but was of a good grade for the types of signals we were dealing with.

A well set up a 708 or Cine7 will give superb pictures. Put them side by side and you would see the difference. Put them in different rooms with same sources etc and I bet you would have to take more than one visit to each room to see the difference.

Only 90% of a CRT set up is science. The extra 10% is art.

[tryingtimes]

Wow - thanks B4. I dodn't know half of that info. Especially not the tube change at 708.

Thanks for the clarification of the input and frequency differences. I'll bear that in mind as at the moment HCPC is in the running.

Your comment about seeing them in different rooms is enough to convince me! I couldn't stretch to a new projector anyway. It does however, seem that the changes on the c7 are worthwhile.

Cheers

Alex

[Stuart Wright]

John, you left out how big the image will be as this does make a difference.Something like 720 non anamorphic at a push, 600 anamorphic with an 8 foot image.The LOWER the resolution, the more noticable the lines. So if you used a prog scan DVD player with only 480 lines, you are more likely to see them.As you get higher resolution and more lines, the projector is less able to resolve them individually and they tend to overlap to produce a softer picture. Not what you want.In anamorphic mode, you are having the projector show the lines in a smaller vertical area and so they are closer together.<br />The optimal setting for my Barco 1209 is 720 lines in anamorphic with a 6.5 foot image.When I swap to non-anamophic, I can see the line structure so though I haven't set it up, yet (since I rarely watch non-anamorphic material), I would try it at 960 lines.When I had a 708, I used 800x600 with an 8 foot screen.

[JohnAd]

Stuart

Thanks for that, 8 ft sounds about right for me. How far away is the projector at that screen size. Also can you get 72 and 75 out of a 708.

John

[Stuart Wright]

Rule of thumb is 1.5 times the image width, so 12 feet. Download the LENS program from the Barco site for exact measurements.And 800x600 @ 72 and 75Hz no problem on a 708.

[Roland @ B4]

Basic Rule of thumb for resloutions with CRTS

7" Cine 7 BD708, BD701 Sony D50 Etc Min line doubled Max line trippled

in 16x9 mode recon on 600 lines (ie 800x600) In 4x3 mode 1024x768. Is about the max you should run in order to stop the projectors blooming (ie the lines over laping) Ignore what the manufactures say about compatible with. (my ford mondeo's speedo is compatible with 160mph ie it will display it)

Same figures above for Electostic focus 8" tubes BG801 and Sony 1271

8" Electromagnetic Focus ie BG808s, Sony G70 etc

16x9 resolution about 700 t0 800 lines so 1280x720 4x3 1280 x1024

9" Electromagnetic ie BG1209s Sony G90 etc

16x9 Best at 1280 x 960

But each model is different, infact each projector can be too.The above assumes that your optical and electrical focus, stigmators and general set up have been done properly.

Spectre is right about throw for CRT's being 1.5 times the screen width ish but check it first fome CRT lenses are as close as 1.1 ie same as screen width (very low resolution lenses by the way)

[ 06-09-2001: Message edited by: B4 ]

[JohnAd]

I'm also coming round to the CRT world at last, but I think I'll also only be able to get away with 7" tubes.

What sort of resolution is ideal for the HTPC compatible 708mm type projectors on a 16/9 screen at 72/75Hz? What sort of screen sizes can these things do before scan lines become noticable.

Also roughly how much are s/h refurbs.

John