Superbit vs. SE vs. Normal vs. Back-up

[Xstyle]

Looking for comparisons between all the dvd formats:

I understand Superbit is THE BEST picture and sound?

Special Editions (SE) may have DTS and 5.1 sound ... isn't this normal on all regular dvd's?

Normal are obviously normal...

Back-ups ... On their own they are illegal. If you have a proper back-up (for whatever reason you want to preserve your original!)... would these be inferior quality in sound and/or picture to the original dvd's ...??

[Thunder]

Sometimes superbits are better than the standard Columbia release but not always. It depends more on the master they used for that particular title. It tends to effect the PQ more than the sound as the audio included is of the same standard of the normal release save the addition of DTS (although some Columbia non superbit releases carry DTS as well) :) DTS is not standard on DVD and although in general my experience is that it usually sounds as good as Dolby if not better it isnt always better, it tends to depend more on the mix and skill of the audio engineer who recorded the track :thumbsup: As for other companies, many match and surpass the superbit standard. Newline cinema are one of my favourites, they tend to have a consistently high standard of video, audio, extras and packaging :grin:

[Xstyle]

Sometimes superbits are better than the standard Columbia release but not always. It depends more on the master they used for that particular title. .........
........ As for other companies, many match and surpass the superbit standard. Newline cinema are one of my favourites, they tend to have a consistently high standard of video, audio, extras and packaging :grin:
So its just pot luck really if the quality of the picture will be any good, ...I mean "better than standard"?

There is no easy way of knowing which normal dvd's will be better than Superbit, and which companies are ALWAYS fantatsic with their picture quality?

[Thunder]

Im affraid not, the best way to find out is to read as many online reviews as possible. Several sites such as dvddebate.com do comparison reviews of different versions :) Sometimes there are comparison reviews on here too :smashin: An example of a disapointing superbit is Leon, its PQ is actually worse than the special edition due to the fact that they used an inferior master :mad: Hence Im waiting for reviews of the deluxe edition due next year :grin:

[Xstyle]

I never knew that before.... or even thought there would be differences like that.
Thanks.

...and it's not even worth viewing "back-up's" is it?

[cj]

...and it's not even worth viewing "back-up's" is it?

That depends on how your back-up is created - 1:1 rips are indeed that, so are not any different to the original.

[rags]

So for example with Fifth Element, which is the one to go for - the R1 Superbit or the R2 Special Edition ?

[Thunder]

R1 superbit because although it has half bit rate DTS audio as opposed full bit rate on the R2 the PQ is far superior on the R1 and theres little noticable difference in the audio :thumbsup:

[8-]]

R1 Superbit for 5th Element.

DVDBeaver and DVDDebate are good sites for comparisons

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/dvdcompare/fifthelement.htm

http://www.dvddebate.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3750

[rags]

Ok thanks guys - where would you buy the R1 Superbit from ? DVDSoon dont appeal to me due to their delivery time lag.

[Thunder]

playusa :)

[Erling]

Here's a great place to look for links to online reviews of DVDs:

http://www.dvd-basen.dk/uk/home.php3

Cheers,
Erling

[bigsby]

That depends on how your back-up is created - 1:1 rips are indeed that, so are not any different to the original.

Backups made with DVDshrink are usually excellent up to about 60% compression.

[Xstyle]

Difference with Special Edition and Normal is that with SE you normally get an Extra's disk??

PQ & audio is the same right??

[Thunder]

It depends, there are no set rules :)

[beecee]

']R1 Superbit for 5th Element.

DVDBeaver and DVDDebate are good sites for comparisons

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/dvdcompare/fifthelement.htm

http://www.dvddebate.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3750


what about the R3 superbit, is it the same as R!?

[Thunder]

As the R1 is generally regarded as outstanding in all areas its highly unlikely that any other releases are, or are going to be significantly better, so get the R1 :thumbsup:

[Xstyle]

Ok... GENERALLY ...

I thought R2 (PAL) has a better picture than R1 (NTSC) FORMATS
due to the lines per *whatever* ... as PAL has more, making it a smoother pic.
:confused:

No?

[Thunder]

Yes if both discs had been sourced from the same place that would probably be the case, but if you read the review lniks posted above, you will see that a different master was used to create the R1 and R2 versions. The master used to create the R1 was far superior and hence the R1 superbit release has a much better picture quality :thumbsup:

[AML]

Something i havent seen mentioned in this thread is the fact that sometimes, the best release isnt always R1 (US) or R2 (UK).
Sometimes its R2 (japan) or R3 (korea)

Example, Black Hawk Down. Best version is the Jap R2.
Picture, Packaging and Sound (DTS)

The R1 release didnt have DTS untill the Superbit version came out.

There are other examples. Dont just blindly go for R1 or R2 (UK) sometimes you need to check other regions for the best quality.

[Xstyle]

Something i havent seen mentioned in this thread is the fact that sometimes, the best release isnt always R1 (US) or R2 (UK).
Sometimes its R2 (japan) or R3 (korea)

Example, Black Hawk Down. Best version is the Jap R2.
Picture, Packaging and Sound (DTS)

The R1 release didnt have DTS untill the Superbit version came out.

There are other examples. Dont just blindly go for R1 or R2 (UK) sometimes you need to check other regions for the best quality.
Understood ... but will it have options for English menu etc?
(I plead ignorant as some dvd's I have had in the past had no English writing for me to understand!)

Thunder... thanks :smashin:

[Thunder]

Something i havent seen mentioned in this thread is the fact that sometimes, the best release isnt always R1 (US) or R2 (UK).
Sometimes its R2 (japan) or R3 (korea)

Example, Black Hawk Down. Best version is the Jap R2.
Picture, Packaging and Sound (DTS)

The R1 release didnt have DTS untill the Superbit version came out.

There are other examples. Dont just blindly go for R1 or R2 (UK) sometimes you need to check other regions for the best quality.

I would say the R3 Superbit deluxe is the best BHD :grin: Most R3s just require you to select english menu system and switch off the subtitles, other than that there generally identical to the R1/R2 with english packaging etc. With Jap discs they tend to have Jap menus and packaging which can be quite confusing :confused: But most of the time Jap discs have the best spec e.g great transfer, packaging, quite often full bit rate DTS (the lucky gits! :laugh: )

[Xstyle]

Why do Japs get the best versions then... curious?
Why can't the same version be done for other regions?

[Thunder]

Dont ask me :confused: Thats the way it is :( You could give the excuse that R2 needs three hundred different sets of subtitles :laugh: But to be honest I just think its because the Japanese consumers are much more demanding and the uptake of the latest technologies is much higher there, so they get the best :)

[Xstyle]

www.dvddebate.com is a good website, but it doesn't have the older films ... like Gone in 60 Seconds...?

[figrin_dan]

That depends on how your back-up is created - 1:1 rips are indeed that, so are not any different to the original.

Not quite, My 1:1 Lion King backup does not have the layer change pause or the non seamless branching pause making it better than the original to me.

I have also been lent a Kill Bill pirate which contained both the US and Japanese versions on the same disc making it better than the originals.

But yes, I understand we are talking PQ here. . .

[Xstyle]

What is a "Vanilla" in relation to DVD's please??


cheers

[tamthetim]

Noticed CD-WOW have a superbit version of SWAT £9.99, haven't seen it yet and interested to see how much better they are than a standard.

Anybody viewed the R2 or 3 of this superbit DVD and/or compared it against the normal version?

Should i order R2 or R3?

Cheers, Tam

http://www5.cd-wow.com/detail_results_2.php?product_code=14507&subcat=region2

[Xstyle]

What is a "Vanilla" in relation to DVD's please??

Vanilla dvd is just the film, with NO extra's at all.
Same picture/audio quality.

Tamthetim ... I've searched the net, and I can't see any comparisons between R2 & R3 SWAT superbit.

Only thing is this:
http://www.dvdcompare.net/comparisons/film.php?fid=4795

[mobile04]

i know in germany theres a 6.1 dts version . is the superbit version r1 still better?

im a little confused . do we really hear the difference?
esp if you are in a small confinement as oposed to a theatre

[Xstyle]

You would hear the difference between Dolby Digital 5.1 and DTS.
Between DTS you wouldn't, as its the same.

Advantage of upgrading to the Superbit dvd, in this instance, would be purely visual.

[DEANO-B]

You would hear the difference between Dolby Digital 5.1 and DTS.
Between DTS you wouldn't, as its the same.

Advantage of upgrading to the Superbit dvd, in this instance, would be purely visual.


DTS is not the same as DD - DTS is far superior. It's not a 'well you can technically tell the difference'. On a good system you can tell the difference straight away!

[FoxyMulder]

Sorry to burst the bubble but DTS isnt vastly sonically superior, in most instances its the different mix which results in better sound.

I like to buy my discs with DTS on them but the DTS is better debate has been raging a long time and the facts are its often the case that its the Mix which determines which sounds better.

Blade 2 for example, they used an identical sound mix for the DVD and the sound is the same.

Saving Private Ryan or The Haunting, they used a totally different sound mix for the DTS track and it sounds superior not because its DTS but BECAUSE ITS A DIFFERENT SOUND MIX, what happens at the sound mixing stage determines which sounds better as the difference between formats is not as great as you would think, another example is frequency response, half bit rate DTS peaks at 18Khz ( some argue 15Khz before it rolls off dramatically )

The sound mix is the most important thing not the sound format.

[Seth Gecko]

Deano-B, I think you misunderstood - he was replying to the previous poster that if you already have a DVD with a DTS mix, then the Superbit version would only offer you an improved picture. On the flip side, as Foxy just elaborated, it would also depend if it was the same mix that was used. You could get a better DTS track IF the mix was sourced differently (at least I THINK that's the case). :thumbsup:

[Thunder]

Sorry to burst the bubble but DTS isnt vastly sonically superior, in most instances its the different mix which results in better sound.

I like to buy my discs with DTS on them but the DTS is better debate has been raging a long time and the facts are its often the case that its the Mix which determines which sounds better.

Blade 2 for example, they used an identical sound mix for the DVD and the sound is the same.

Saving Private Ryan or The Haunting, they used a totally different sound mix for the DTS track and it sounds superior not because its DTS but BECAUSE ITS A DIFFERENT SOUND MIX, what happens at the sound mixing stage determines which sounds better as the difference between formats is not as great as you would think, another example is frequency response, half bit rate DTS peaks at 18Khz ( some argue 15Khz before it rolls off dramatically )

The sound mix is the most important thing not the sound format.

carefull foxy :lease: dont start another one of those threads :)

[DEANO-B]

Sorry to burst the bubble but DTS isnt vastly sonically superior, in most instances its the different mix which results in better sound.

I like to buy my discs with DTS on them but the DTS is better debate has been raging a long time and the facts are its often the case that its the Mix which determines which sounds better.

Blade 2 for example, they used an identical sound mix for the DVD and the sound is the same.

Saving Private Ryan or The Haunting, they used a totally different sound mix for the DTS track and it sounds superior not because its DTS but BECAUSE ITS A DIFFERENT SOUND MIX, what happens at the sound mixing stage determines which sounds better as the difference between formats is not as great as you would think, another example is frequency response, half bit rate DTS peaks at 18Khz ( some argue 15Khz before it rolls off dramatically )

The sound mix is the most important thing not the sound format.


Hi, sorry about being technically innacurate, but in real listening terms most DTS disks do sound vastly superior, whether its due to the mix or not! Potentially DD is as good as/better than DTS does'nt make any difference if the end result if inferior. If DD soundtracks do improve their sound mix in the future then I will be the first one to say 'DD is now the best format' but for the here and now DTS is far superior! I'm not trying to be clever here and I understand what your saying, but you can not judge things by what they could do - but on what they actually do! If given the option of DD vs DTS 99% of people would choose DTS. I suppose when I replied to the comment earlier I should have chose my words a bit more carefully. sorry. ;)

[figrin_dan]

DTS is not the same as DD - DTS is far superior. It's not a 'well you can technically tell the difference'. On a good system you can tell the difference straight away!

I disagree, on a high quality system, you'd be hard pushed to tell the difference. On an average system (as most of us have) dts is superior. On a cheap system, I don't know.

[Jules]

I disagree, on a high quality system, you'd be hard pushed to tell the difference. On an average system (as most of us have) dts is superior.
I agree.
I used to subscribe to the idea that DTS was superior, but on my current high end kit there's really nothing in it... particularly now with 'half rate' DTS used as standard. In fact, the Dolby decoding is so good on my kit that I no longer bother with DTS at all.

However, full rate DTS (of which there are sadly very few examples) is a different story.

[Xstyle]

I agree.
I used to subscribe to the idea that DTS was superior, but on my current high end kit there's really nothing in it... particularly now with 'half rate' DTS used as standard. In fact, the Dolby decoding is so good on my kit that I no longer bother with DTS at all.

However, full rate DTS (of which there are sadly very few examples) is a different story.
But you're hardly ever going to know 'by chance' which dvd has half rate and full rate DTS ... and if half rate DTS is more or less the same as DD, then you may as well put it on DTS all the time, if available.

[Xstyle]

I really like this thread.. and believe its great for newbies... :hiya:

(damn, all those questions I asked almost 2 years ago!)
hee hee

[pjr918bmw]

Don't know whether it's high end kit or not... but I struggle to hear a significant difference between DTS and DD most of the time. (AVC-a11xva and Castle Harlechs etc)

Saving P R is better on DTS - but that is probably the mix. As an opposite, in my opinion the DD mix is better than the DTS on Ice Age 2 - again the mix?

It's whatever your ears tell you - but to be honest a dvd having a DTS track or not would not make me buy it or leave it!

[Xstyle]

Ok... GENERALLY ...

I thought R2 (PAL) has a better picture than R1 (NTSC) FORMATS
due to the lines per *whatever* ... as PAL has more, making it a smoother pic.
:confused:
Yes if both discs had been sourced from the same place that would probably be the case,...

I think this is very important to remember... in the PAL v NTSC debate.
Pal is better IF both Pal & NTSC are derived from the same source material...

[figrin_dan]

Pal is better IF both Pal & NTSC are derived from the same source material...

+ other factors. . .

[Xstyle]

+ other factors. . .

such as.... ?

[Xstyle]

such as.... ?


PAL v NTSC detailed information here:

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=428204


:lesson: