View Full Version : Z2 colorfacts calibration
Kramer
12-12-2003, 5:25 PM
Originally posted by buns
Iris..... it doesnt alter anything save the light output.
Yes indeed.
High fan is loud. Low lamp is quieter than my pc, but anyone who calls it silent listens to movies wayyyyy too loud!
Certainly not "whisper" quiet as claimed.
Overall, alot better than my old machine even out of the box
It was bound to be :)
Come on Ad, get stuck in & tweak it to within an inch of its life (or a HS10 :p ).
BTW, haven't read how yours is with VB/FPN?
:smoke:
Kramer
12-12-2003, 5:44 PM
Originally posted by buns
sorry i missed the VB/FPN...... it is totally a calibration issue. I can have it totally invisible......
Good news, but what "side effects" does eliminating this have? eg. reducing/increasing panel voltage/gain/bias may result in dire grey scale tracking (impossible perhaps?).
As you say, the settings interact so maybe with the VB/FPN "tweaked", accurate calibration may be impossible?
Why else would Sanyo, Panasonic & Epson release these PJs with noticeable banding if it's just a setup issue?
If the banding is (as I believe) a panel issue, you may just be masking the problem rather than curing it & causing more problems in the process.
Good work though, look forward to an update later :)
KraGorn
12-12-2003, 6:05 PM
Mine shows no VB that I've seen yet, either watching video or using Avia ... I'm not sure what FPN looks like but I don't think I've seen it. :)
This is out-of-the-box, the only calibration I've done is Avia .. I wouldn't know how to get into the magical 'service menu' anyway. :grin:
WeirdFish
12-12-2003, 7:41 PM
As a newcomer to the world of PJ's I'm interested to read all these different deficiencies in PQ. To me I'm so pleased with the 6ft picture I now have.
I realise its because I'm new to it and I'm sure a year down the line I'll be pulling the latest PJ apart, but I leaves me wondering, if the Z2 is so bad what were the previous PJ's like :eek:
BTW I'm not critising the 'tweaking', I'm very interested in it. Although a little scared of touching settings yet :blush:
Gary Lightfoot
12-12-2003, 8:16 PM
Buns,
would a filter help with the red? I think the FLD filter helps to reduce green and blue, so that should bring the red to within a similar range. Calibrating may be easier then, and as the iris only changes light output, you can open it a little to get the lumens back.
Does that sound like a fix? I believe many other LCDs get better results with filters, and it can also improve contrast. I read a review by Guy Kuo who did a similar thing with his HT1000, so it's not just LCDs that can benefit from a filter equalising the colours.
Gary.
HappyLad
12-12-2003, 8:31 PM
Errr. sorry for being a bit dumb....
But what is FPN ???
homethx
12-12-2003, 9:52 PM
Fixed Pattern Noise
HappyLad
12-12-2003, 11:33 PM
Originally posted by homethx
Fixed Pattern Noise
So, is this what is sometimes called "scan lines" - horizontal lines in area of solid colours, usually during vertical pans.
Or the "digital shimmer" of pixel noise, again in large area of solid or very similar colour
:confused:
for ref..... i can easily get horizontal lines......
I have been through all settings which im told specifically relate to red, none of them help me above 50 IRE...... further phone call to sanyo may be in order :grin:
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increasingly liking the idea of an alternative solution..... I just cant shift this red at high IRE values....
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Gary Lightfoot
13-12-2003, 2:53 AM
What kind of alternative? Filter maybe or is that going the wrong direction?
Gary.
I dunno...... what i do know is that i reallly shouldnt be up this late! :eek:
AVS ers assured me that the red thing was all easy sorted...... certainly in my case it definitely is not. I was expecting to tweak half a dozen settings by half a dozen values..... it seems that I need to be changing twice that many and i could be altering them by upwards of 50 points..... i must be doing something wrong
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Gary Lightfoot
13-12-2003, 3:47 AM
lol, well, lateness is a sign of a tweaker. I'm messing with TMPGenc setings as we speak. I shouldn't be up this late either!
Maybe you aught to get to bed and make a fresh start tomorrow, that sometimes helps.
Gary.
unfortunately the moring has not brought new life...... I will categorically state that I cannot get the red correct using any settings in user or up to 24 in the service...... so either that means that the rendition in general is pretty bad, or im unlucky!
and before everyone chines in that their is ok...... i would have said the same but my colorimeter tells me different.
phone call to sanyo this morning!
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Quatermass
13-12-2003, 9:31 AM
Hmm, I was wondering if the "red shift" is built in on the grounds that your average punter prefers a "warmer" picture.....
chris l.
13-12-2003, 10:47 AM
I always go back to the test / tuning undertaken by cine4home.de
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.cine4home.de/&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dcine4home%2Bde%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie %3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8
They nearly got it perfect but it was the blue deviation that they could not get to grips with in the end, but they got fairly close.
They now offer a mail order calibration service for the Z2 in partnership with projektor-tuning.de
http://216.239.37.104/translate_c?hl=en&u=http://www.projektor-tuning.de/&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dcine4home%2Bde%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie %3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8
Ok they set the Z2 to optimum based on their kit and so it does not take account of everyone’s individual DVD source etc, but it shows that the Z2 can be tuned to near perfection, with the right kit.
Chris
well i would like to know how exactly they did it
the best yet that I have achieved I attach..... note the red at the end which I cant shift
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Gary Lightfoot
13-12-2003, 12:34 PM
I see what you mean. A filter will bring the green and blue down, so I think that for about £25, that has got to be worth a try at least.
Have you spoken with Sanyo yet?
Gary
sanyo dont work at weekends..... :eek:
of further interest..... i can get things not so bad by using the service menu using 7-9...... but as soon as i move to another menu other than 7-9 or out of nmenus totally..... it all changes! :eek: yet the settings are all the same..... see attached as proof!
and before i switched out of the service mode...... but identially the same settings....
Gary Lightfoot
13-12-2003, 1:46 PM
Got a gun? ;)
Gary.
Quatermass
13-12-2003, 2:49 PM
Interesting graphs Buns. Red goes a different way to what I thought i.e. less not more (if I am interpretating them correctly!).
Noticed that the German site talked about calibrating the entire signal chain including the dvd player– wondered therefore if it could be your dvd player that is helping to push the red readings out?
it is different to i had thought it would be too...... but there you have it!
my dvd player shouldnt be the problem...... it is very well respected and i know it isnt the pc because i have been fiddling. anyhow..... im looking into different ways of calibrating.....
ad
gf is over and we decided to watch a film..... for once it wasnt my gf who distracted me!
I had set it to one of the user presets with service as i got it...... eek is the only thing i can say! Needs serious tweaking!!!!!
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Kramer
13-12-2003, 11:23 PM
Originally posted by buns
eek is the only thing i can say! Needs serious tweaking!!!!!
Well what are you waiting for? Get "stuck in" :p
Kramer wonders if having Colourfacts is a good thing or a bad thing for Buns :)
Originally posted by Kramer
Well what are you waiting for? Get "stuck in" :p
Kramer wonders if having Colourfacts is a good thing or a bad thing for Buns :)
Well..... im learning alot..... for instance I know that the Z2 reds are a relative weakness, I have been told that my findings confirm the Z2 clips its reds quite easily.
Though all said..... I have had it for 3 days and I have clocked up about 15 hours and only 2 are from watching software! :eek:
anyhow..... Im going to go and eliminate problems down the chain (scoped pc settings etc) and have another blast. I had the red up acceptably at 30 and 100 IRE but raised dramatically in between.... I figure this is a good thing and I can get it right with gamma fiddling.
wish me luck!
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wohoo..... it now looks as good as i expected out of the box! :grin:
WeirdFish
14-12-2003, 5:41 PM
At last! Shame the Z2 is now out of date.......;)
so whats the new kid then!? :eek: :p
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I tell you, im darned glad that taking a greyscale is as easy as 30 seconds..... I have now done soooooo many!
balance at 80 IRE..... balance at 30 IRE..... balance with gamma.... balance again.....they interact so much that i need to take a full greyscale every time! I have greyscale charts coming out of my ears! :eek:
I would just love someone to tell me this is not normal..... that my z2 is faulty..... it would ease my pain so much more than I ever considered hearing 'faulty projector' ever could!
anyone seen the *bashes head off wall* smiley?! :eek:
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theritz
14-12-2003, 10:53 PM
ad,
anyone seen the *bashes head off wall* smiley?!
In the absence of being able to offer any useful advice in your quest to calibrate your new toy (sounds like hell to me................), at least I can offer you some suitable emoticons.............
How about this...... http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung0903/sprachlos/speechless-smiley-004.gif ............. or this... http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung0903/sprachlos/speechless-smiley-037.gif or this...... http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung0903/fragend/confused-smiley-013.gif or this...... http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung0903/wuerg/vomit-smiley-011.gif ........
No wish to turn this erudite and educational thread topic into a "who can find the most suitable smilie for buns" thread .........
Watching and waiting with interest, though I suspect that without a service manual you'll continue to have difficulties - no doubt you'll be phoning Sanyo in the morning........
See ya,
Sean.
/wonders if Kramer will find a bigger noisier longer-throw higher resolution smilie.......................
:grin: Thanks Sean! Knew someone would come through for me!
Im getting help directly from Mark Hunter and also on the colorfacts forum, so im still hopeful I am doing something wrong. Unfortunately i cant see an easy way around the fact that my red begins low and I cant raise it..... it rather sounds like a situation that is inevitably a big compromise. Im a bit reluctant to phone sanyo straight of..... without knowing there is a problem, I could end up sending it in to get it looked at and it coming back no better or getting a new one and it being the same..... which would be rather a waste of time! :eek:
In any case..... its too late now just to settle for it, i can see the problems wayyy too easily!
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Wilster
15-12-2003, 12:29 PM
Perhaps you could make a trip to someone elses Z2 and try callibrating it? Then you would know if your's is a faulty one! You are welcome to come and see mine :grin:
Originally posted by Wilster
Perhaps you could make a trip to someone elses Z2 and try callibrating it? Then you would know if your's is a faulty one! You are welcome to come and see mine :grin:
I think this would be worthwhile - it would at least give you an idea if your Z2 is indeed faulty.
Paul
Originally posted by PaulB
I think this would be worthwhile - it would at least give you an idea if your Z2 is indeed faulty.
Paul
No can do..... at the moment im unaware of any Z2 owners in NI. I know davyb is getting one, but time is an issue and I want it working for xmas.
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on instruction from Ken at ivojo, im checking the s video to see if what i have is a dvi issue, so i will post them all!
First up, svideo on high temp.
and then the same but mid temp.
oh..... note the time of posting here, im taking these charts as i put them up, testement to the ease of use of colorfacts!
and low 2
further note, panel type structure is distinct from VB. VB on svideo is less than on dvi. But its not all rosey, the avia patterns im using clearly show high frequency noise on the gray panels using the svideo
and low 3
Now I think this fairly conclusively shows that the user rgb settings are acting primarily at low IRE values, at least for this run using svideo.
Next up..... confirm the dvi....
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we have dvi temperature high
and last but definitely not least..... dvi low 3 temp
Now does anyone doubt that there is something strange here?! In both dvi and svideo, the high IRE red just is not showing its head..... At least this rules out the problem being solely dvi related!
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Klippie
15-12-2003, 8:21 PM
Buns,
It was mentioned in the other thread about the possiblity of trying a filter to up the red value this worked wonders for the Sony HS10 once tweaked improved the image ten fold.
The filters people prefered were CC20R to CC40R, Lee filters are about £8 and are 75mm x 75mm in size and can be ordered from any good camera shop i.e. Jessops.
Another quick check could be to place the red filter from Avia or DVE over the lens and take a reading just to see what happens, they are very red compaired to a CC40R filter and will blast the red value sky high.
Klippie.
Hi there Klippie,
I havent yet ruled out the filter idea, it was also suggested over at colorfacts forum. However, given that other have reported getting a ruler flat and balanced the whole way with the machine as it came to them..... so frankly I dont feel I should settle easily for something that is so far from that reality!
Besides..... sanyo themselves told me it should be pretty well calibrated out of the box...... (im not sure i believe it though)
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Quatermass
16-12-2003, 9:01 AM
It does seem very strange (not that I know anything about all this!) that you can adjust the blue so much throughout the ire range but that the red stubbornly stays in that 50% area at high ire levels Certainly this wasn’t the case with the German results which does seem to indicate that something somewhere is knackered! Are there no colorfacts graphs for the Z2 available from the US with which to compare? (I guess not!). I found a smart generated graph for the Z1 (out of the box settings) which shows the kind of results I would have expected with the Z2 (i.e. too much red!).
Gavin_Hall
16-12-2003, 9:15 AM
What are you using as the source of the video? Have you thought about trying a different DVD player, just to rule the source out as being the cause of the problem?
Grasping at straws I know, but you need to rule everything out here!! :confused:
Gavin
Quatermass,
I had expected that sort of graph too! Then taking the german site mentioned as a guide, getting all 3 colors at 100% right through the IRE range shouldnt be dificult.
Gavin_hall,
Im using an sdi modified panasonic rp82 which is processed by a holo3d capture card and then output via dvi from a radeon 7500. The player using sdi shouldnt be a problem, the sdi feed is tapped off before the player itself has a chance to do anything to the picture. So were it the dvd player, it would basically be a problem with one of the chips..... the primary one which is actually reknowned for its good abilities, I certainly hope it isnt this! The pc, well in that an svideo from dvd player to projector without the pc in the chain was similar to the dvi results (using sdi to pc), this suggests that it isnt the pc at fault. Dvi cable..... well as Ken told me, there can be issues. We have (in those graphs) shown that if dvi is an issue for me, then there is also something going wrong with the svideo. So although we havent ruled out dvi as the problem, to say it is also means that there are 2 distinct problems and the likelyhood of this should be low. What else is there..... well the best I can say is that I was never previousl bothered by purple clouds and red skin with my old projector using the same dvd/pc set up..... so although i dont have quantative measurements, my feeling is that the colors on my old sanyo plv30 were alot more accurate. That said, on a pc display the Z2 looks pretty killer...... shame that wasnt what its primary use entails!
The only other thing I can think of (and i dont want to!) is that my hardware for measuring is wrong. I strongly doubt this!!!! As i mention, I can clearly see purple clouds and red skin..... so my eyes are agreeing with the measurement so this is almost definitely not at fault.
Anyhow, projector is next day returned, so fingers crossed to have a new one on thursday!
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Quatermass
16-12-2003, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by buns
Anyhow, projector is next day returned, so fingers crossed to have a new one on thursday!
If the new unit is a big improvement then imo the colorfacts will have justified its $ in one fell swoop!! Got to wonder how many people are sat watching dodgy projectors without knowing it….aaaaah, I might be one of them :zonked:
Kramer
16-12-2003, 10:32 AM
http://www.kramer.utvinternet.com/crack.jpg
Reckon you could do anything with that Ad? My HS10 :(
NOT! :p
Soz, bit of crack :) Will remove it shortly.
trust me, if your projector was way off, you would see it! Find yourself a scene with light and darkish..... say something from vertical limit would show my problem well. Get an image with someone face on a snowy backdrop (just make sure they arent meant to be red faced at this point!). You yourself know what a cloud looks like and what normal skin tone is..... if it looks ok to you, then id bet it probably is.
Ad
Originally posted by Kramer
www.kramer.utvinternet.com/bitofcrack.jpg
Recon you could do anything with that Ad? My HS10 :(
NOT! :p
Soz, bit of crack :) Will remove it shortly.
lol, you are a man with standards i see! :p
have you actually done a pro calibration or even just measurements!? :p :grin:
So thats a thought for you, i can do a machine analysis in about 15 minutes flat..... next time im down your way......
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Kramer
16-12-2003, 10:38 AM
Originally posted by buns
have you actually done a pro calibration or even just measurements!? :p :grin:
Are you suggesting that my "histogram" isn't genuine?
What would you think that :confused:
:grin: :grin:
15 minutes, ahhhhhh, but which 15 minutes?
:)
Quatermass
16-12-2003, 10:51 AM
Kramer, is that graph showing the out of the box settings or the ones after you calibrated it? :grin: Either way looks pretty good for an HS10 :p
Buns, thanks for info. Yeah, actually my Z2 seems ok - bit of red push I saw I got rid of. DVE disk should arrive today so I can calibrate with a bit more accuracy.
Originally posted by Kramer
15 minutes, ahhhhhh, but which 15 minutes?
:)
i'll let you know when im coming to break your heart........ :p I dont think id want to just go to somene to do an analysis..... if it turned out bad they probebly wouldnt ever speak to me again!
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WSquared
17-12-2003, 11:30 AM
buns,
Rob Dingen's instructions over at the colorfacts forum should lead you to finally cracking the calibration.
One thing to mention is that if you are getting a new projector, it will not be run in. The colours that it can produce will not be the same as those after 60-100 hours. You may find that you can't get it perfect now, but that you might be able to after it has been run in.
Cheers, William
Kane D Williams
30-12-2003, 3:57 PM
Buns,
My Low 1, Low 2 and Low 3 (user settings) all look very red, unwatchable to me! the High setting looks a little too blue (as one would expect) and the Mid looks closest to natural, but still red skintones. This makes me think that my Z2 and yours are very different out of the box?
I would agree...... you can see the plots i posted..... no way those could be interpreted red! Maybe, as you say, we just have very different machines. However, it is important to note that it is logical that the red be dfficient due to the nature of the lamp...... so it is actually a bit odd for a red bias
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Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 12:45 AM
Hi Buns,
I wa down at RTFMs yesterday, and met Paul Hayward and Alan Roser of Sim2. Had a brilliant time!
Paul brought his Colorfacts along and we compared them with SMART. Wow - Colorfacts is a tremendous piece of kit!! :eek:
I couldn't believe how quick adjustments could be registered, tweaked and a graph produced. The three column display while Colorfacts kept taking readings meant that adjustments made take literaly minutes to get the levels flat and D65 within a gnats whisker. SMART is excellent value, but time consuming, and data has to be entered manualy. We did take some readings at the same point, but I need the info back from Paul to try and compare them.
How far from the screen do you have the detector (eye one?)? Alan felt that it should be closer than Paul had it at the time (due to the cable length from his laptop to the sensor), but the greyscale did have a very faint pink tinge to it at the higher ire levels when the figures werte about right. A few more tweaks could have been made, but we were getting onto other things by then - watching various movie clips for instance. :)
I would so much like to have on for myself, so I'll be considering it after I've finished with SMART... :)
Gary.
Gary,
I have been reading about your fun over at avs! :grin:
I have a detector that says pantone colorvison on it..... i dont know exactly what that means! Ive been using it about 12 to 18 inches from the screen, but given that ive accepted low IRE readings to be questionable, i havent really thought too much about it.
Of course its taking only minutes to get right is very much down to the user! For me to get things flat, it will yet take me an hour or so to be happy..... of course that is related to the fact that every adjustment requires me to exit the service mode! :mad:
I dont yet know why i went for it to be honest..... for a guy with a £1k projector it seems a bit silly doesnt it! :grin: all the same, im glad i did, its been such fun to play with and so easy to use..... plus im sure i will be through half a dozen projectors in no time so it will surely earn its keep!
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Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 1:15 AM
Paul has the GretagMacbeth EyeOne Beamer. It was around 8ft from the screen I think, but still seemed to take good readins, although the lower ire readings took a while longer to get.
Paul also said that what he sometimes does is to take just the 40 and 80ire readings and get them close. It can cut down on time. Using the RGB bar graph was quick because he was able to go into the Sim2 Links user menu and get to the RGB gain/bias easily. Red was low, but bringing the GB down then tweaking them all took no time at all.
Colorfacts is very expensive - seems to have gone up $500 since I last looked at the CF6000, but if you're doing a lot of pjs, it's worth it's weight in gold. So tempting though... How did you persuade yourself? :)
Wanna buy the Eye one on my behalf and lend me the Colorfacts disk? ;)
Gary.
The beamer looks great, but i dont have sufficent bias of money over sense for me to have got one :grin:
The way colorfacts recommends is to balance at 30 and 80 IRE.... it works pretty well but i preferred using a higher IRE for the upper one (seeing as it was there that my problems lay). But in any case, yes its a breeze!
I didnt persuade myself btw..... Mark Hunter of Colorfacts responded personally to some comments i made on avs and based on what he said, i decided that my initial thought of SMART was likely going to end up being upgraded to colorfacts anyhow.... so there you have it!
One cool feature of the latest colorfacts software (i guess you saw this) is the licensing..... the little usb dongle is very cool indeed..... but unfortunately i think it rules out your plan!
On a plus note..... im sending you a pm! ;)
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Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 2:05 AM
I read your pm before this, so my reply may seem to cover stuff you've mentioned. Oh well, ignore where applicable!
Can you point me to the thread so I can read Marks comments? I'm curious that's all. :)
Thanks again,
Gary.
Quatermass
31-12-2003, 8:32 AM
Originally posted by buns
I dont yet know why i went for it to be honest..... for a guy with a £1k projector it seems a bit silly doesnt it! :grin:
I did wonder but didn’t like to ask! :grin:
Still, as you say, it is likely to be a good investment over the long term.
When I gaze into my crystal ball I see buns with a dlp pj sometime in 2004 (as long as you don’t suffer from rainbows that is) :grin:
Gordon @ Convergent AV
31-12-2003, 8:32 AM
Buns has the tri-stimulus pod while Paul has the gretamacbeth spectroradiometer pod. The licencing means that the pod and software are locked together so borrowing a pod means you need to borrow the PC it's used with as well. If Mark did a Ipaq type interface this might not be such an issue.
As Buns has pointed out in this thread there is more to all this calibration mallarky than meets the eye.
Gordon
WSquared
31-12-2003, 8:48 AM
The tri-stimulus colorimeters that can(or previously could) be purchased (CF6500 & CF100 respectively) with Colorfacts are not as accurate as the Gretagmacbeth EyeOne Spectroradiometer for non-CRT devices. The reason is that the sensors in the tristimulus devices are tuned in to narrow wavelength ranges around the color primaries of the phosphors traditionally used in CRTs. Great quick analysis tool for CRT analysis, low cost too.
However, the color primaries of most plasmas,LCD,DLP,etc do not use the same color primaries. That is why most calibrators using colorfacts have opted for the Eye-One(CF6000).
Mark had claimed that the old CF100 used 8 sensors to provide better results with non-CRT devices. There was some controversy over this point. Many calibrators had the CF100 for a time. IIRC, it was labeled as Pantone Colorvision and recognised by colorfacts as Pantone Spyder. I never got to test this against the EyeOne because I sent my CF100 back to upgrade to the CF6000.
William
Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 12:39 PM
"As Buns has pointed out in this thread there is more to all this calibration mallarky than meets the eye."
Indeed. In fact there should be a cut-out in the case to put a small revolver in there with all the other gubbins, so that if it should all get too much... ;)
Gary.
Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 12:48 PM
Hi William,
Do you have any links for the controversy over Marks claims re 8 detectors and it's accuracy with respct to the Eye One and DLP for instance?
TIA
Gary.
Gordon,
The software i have does not have the locking of detector to pc. It has a usb dongle that as far as i know, locks dongle to detector..... so you can use it on multiple pcs, this being a relatively recent thing i think. Very handy :grin:
As Will points out, the eye one is better..... but i couldnt afford it and im not a calibrator, only an enthusiast so im in a slightly different boat.
Gary,
have you been to www.milori.com ? It has a load of info and has a support forum which has been very useful to me so far. Ive found Mark better to contact directly, his commenting publically will obviously lead to contest from some direction, almost irrelevanbt of what he says. So I can understand that.
From what I recall, he told me that the sensitivity at mid/high IRE was not going to bother someone in my situation. The low IRE is something my detector wont be brilliant at, but you pays your money..... as i mentioned, can always change later.
I dont know what the crystal ball holds for my pj future..... someone point me at a machine which has decent blacks, good resolution, fits my room, and doesnt depreciate fast enough to make me sick..... then i wont need to change it any time soon! :grin: Until then i will just keep upgrading in a fashion that looses me as little cash as possible!
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Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 1:13 PM
Thanks for the info Ad, will have a look...
What's the new machine? :)
Gary.
No new one yet Gary........ im waiting...... next one i can think of might be the ht1000 and anamorphic lens (assuming the price drop when it is replaced). Cant see anything else at the mo!
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Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 1:37 PM
You won't be dissapointed with the NEC, it's a nice little machine (provided you don't see rainbows). Hopefully you'll be able to pick up one at a nice price when the HT1100 comes out. :)
The Prismasonic lens are well priced too, though in my case that would alter the image position and I probably wouldn't be able to get the picture on the screen without some major alterations somewhere..
Gary.
WSquared
31-12-2003, 1:53 PM
Gary, I don't mean that the CF100 was supposed to be better than the EyeOne. I mean it was supposed to be better than other tri-stimulus colorimeters at the time, ie sencore and progressive labs. I can't remember where the claim was made of 8 sensors in the CF100 was made. Probably on avsforum.
Gary Lightfoot
31-12-2003, 1:56 PM
Thank for the info. :)
Gary.
Quatermass
31-12-2003, 2:05 PM
Originally posted by buns
someone point me at a machine which ..... doesnt depreciate fast enough to make me sick..... Until then i will just keep upgrading in a fashion that looses me as little cash as possible!
Yep, that's my philosophy on av as well!
for anyone interested, there is a thread over at avs analysing the Z2 service mode...... http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=339768
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