Tweeter to ear level how important is it?

suciosucio5

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Ok so i have my hi fi set up in a fairly small bedroom, its consists off a denon dm37dab and mordaunt short 902i's.

The tweeter's are just very slightly above ear level when standing up, most of my listening is done walking around and getting ready to go out etc, although some listening is done sitting down.

I'm not sure whether to keep my speakers where they are or lower them.

how important is it to get the tweeter to ear level, does it have to be accurate or can it just be roughly right? would the average listener be able to tell the difference?

i don't really want to tilt the speakers becuase that would mean i have to screw into the cabinet to keep it secure and for reassurance.

cheers.
 
The tweeter's are just very slightly above ear level when standing up, most of my listening is done walking around and getting ready to go out etc, although some listening is done sitting down.

If I were you, I wouldn't worry about moving them, as you've stated that the majority of listening is done when standing. It might be more of a problem if they were on the floor. I'm guessing this is for music? It might be more of an issue if you were talking about home cinema and being sat in the same place for upto 3 hours, but as you're not I wouldn't worry.

Just an idea but have you tried temporarily moving them down a shade to see if it makes a big difference.
 
Yeah the system mostly used for music playback and the odd film/music dvd.

For example i just watched a pink floyd concert on dvd and this is the first time playing back a live music dvd with my speakers and it did sound brilliant. bass was maybe a bit over the top and i was thinking maybe this is becuase i was watching it sitting down and the speakers are above my head, but mind you it was on full bass minus the dynamic bass boost, no complaints really, the speakers haven't even run in fully yet!

i haven't tried temporarily moving them down as it looks as if i would have to drill new 2 or 3 holes for where the bracket goes, i have quite a few holes already there which i may be able to utilize if im lucky but i dont really want to be adding more if it isn't really worth it.

I think you are right with the issue being more of a problem if the speakers were lower down or on the floor.

anyone else got any views?
 
Also bear in mind that it also depends on distance from the speaker. If you imagine the point of a cone starting at the speaker. anywhere within this cone will sound good.

The higher frequency the speaker handles the narrower the cone. so tweeters are more critical than mid and bass speakers and the further away from the speaker you are the bigger the sweet spot gets. This still allows some leeway but less for the tweeter than the other cones, which is why its recommended to have the tweeters at ear level (and why it doesn't matter where your sub is if you ignore room effects and standing waves etc)

I have a pair of old Mordaunt floor standers in my kitchen/dining room, the tweeter is probably about ear height when slouching on a sofa, however we either sit on the dining chairs or are stood up while listening. I've found any closer than about 2-3 metres it sounds weird. further away its fine as the sound from the tweeter has dispersed enough (think about the cone)
 
My front speakers are above seated ear level in my lounge but I use a couple of Auralex MoPADs to tilt them down so they're pointing at where I'm sitting.
 
JimBobVFR400 - thanks for your comments and i understand what you mean by the cone, however as said before my room is pretty small and the listening position is about 1-2 meteres so i cant really do much about that for now, at least it helps in the future when moving the system to a bigger room.

Im just trying to get the best position for now.
 
My front speakers are above seated ear level in my lounge but I use a couple of Auralex MoPADs to tilt them down so they're pointing at where I'm sitting.

Oh right that's interesting.. so are you speakers on stands or brackets then?
i dont see how these pads enabled you to tilt the speakers.

I have the B tech bt77 brackets which allow tilt but if i do tilt them i will have to screw into the cabinet for added security which i dont really want to do.
 
It is true you need the tweeters generally at ear level, but not precisely at ear level.

Sound radiates from the tweeter in a cone that is about ±15° from the center line. Most speakers are tested both straight on, and at 30° off axis to show how the ultra-high frequencies drop off, off axis.

So, the prime sound would be within ±15°, with the sound being acceptable within ±30°.

Naturally, the closer you are to the speaker, the narrower the cone, and the more critical the placement.

A quick test on my own speakers, at a comfortable listening distance of 10 feet, the 15° arc is 24 inches. So, at 10 feet the cone of sound has expanded to a full 48 inches (±24"). That's pretty wide.

So, yes, generally you want the speakers roughly ear level, but it doesn't have to be precisely so.

What JimBobVFR400 is referring to is called beaming, and to some extent it is the reason why Subwoofers work. At low frequencies, the sound is radiating into 360° space. At the bass rises up to the Baffle Step, it shifts from 360° to 180°. Above this frequency, the bass no longer sounds as if it is coming from everywhere. It becomes more directional and the Subwoofer effect is lost.

As frequencies continue to increase the beam of sound gets narrower and narrower. But, as pointed out, it is generally considered still pretty good at the highest frequencies and within the suggested are of ±15°.

Steve/bluewizard
 
Cheers Bluewizard, i fully understand now.

For now i will just leave them where they are as i dont want to drill anymore holes, they are about 8 holes either side now! in total thats 16 holes! and i only use 4 either side, ha.

The tweeter is roughly ear level anyway. i suppose i always have the option of tilting them but just dont want screws in the speaker cabinet.



Oh yeah also would just like to say about something i think you quoted in another thread about speakers. You said something along the lines of " do you hear bass or bass guitar?" i can see exactly what you mean by that now and i can hear that difference alot more easily with my new setup :clap:


Cheers. :)
 
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Oh right that's interesting.. so are you speakers on stands or brackets then?
i dont see how these pads enabled you to tilt the speakers.

These are auralex mopads, they are used to help with isolating speakers and reducing resonance.

Auralex MoPADs

They come with wedges which you can have to tilt the speaker up or down. I use them on my centre speaker which is on a shelf above the TV to tilt downwards towards the listening position.
 
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Due to my listening room constraints, conventional wisdom has had to go out of the window. I have managed to get the centre and the surrounds at near to ear as poss, but the fronts are about 20cm from the ceiling, towed in and angled down at roughly 20 degrees! Despite this they sound fabulous in all modes.
 
It is not so much that the speakers need to be at ear level, as it is that the tweeters need to be pointed at you.

For example, a low placed center speaker could be tilted up slightly to point more at the listeners.

Or as A8ch points out, his speakers are mounted up high with the speakers pointed down and inward ... at the listener. So, naturally his setup works fine.

So, again, don't think of the tweeters needing to be at ear level as much as why they need to be at ear level. And that is, to keep the listener in the prime listening range of the relatively narrow beaming tweeters.

As long as the speakers are generally pointed at the listener, they should be OK.

The reference to 'ear level' is based on typical bookshelf speakers on typical stands, and is a general guideline, not an absolute rule.

Steve/bluewizard
 
Yeah the system mostly used for music playback and the odd film/music dvd.

For example i just watched a pink floyd concert on dvd and this is the first time playing back a live music dvd with my speakers and it did sound brilliant. bass was maybe a bit over the top and i was thinking maybe this is becuase i was watching it sitting down and the speakers are above my head, but mind you it was on full bass minus the dynamic bass boost, no complaints really, the speakers haven't even run in fully yet!

Hi

Not sure if I am taking this wrong, but not sure what what you mean by this, and its possible it could cause you eventually blown speakers if your bass control is full up!
 
Hi

Not sure if I am taking this wrong, but not sure what what you mean by this, and its possible it could cause you eventually blown speakers if your bass control is full up!

hmm i don't think so, that would be more likely to happen if i had it on very high volume in which case i dont. that makes sense, surely?
 
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hmm i don't think so, that would be more likely to happen if i had it on very high volume in which case i dont. that makes sense, surely?

Even at moderate levels, putting the bass tone control up beyond say 3-4 o'clock forces your amp into having deliver more power to the bass frequencies and you run into possibly clipping.
 
I've been trying sooo hard not to reply to this thread but it has got the better of me. With respect to the original poster, it isn't difficult to listen to your music at different heights to the tweeters and decide yourself if you can perceive a difference, is it? If you can, and it detracts from your enjoyment, there is your answer. Most problems on this forum have a much harder or more expensive solution than "try moving your head up and down".

And as for altering the bass control, if you are concerned about minor issues with your setup like tweeter height you might want to consider that altering the tone controls is artificially distorting your music :facepalm:

Minor rant over :thumbsup:
 
Soz, just re-read that, didn't mean it to sound annoyed lol :suicide:
 
Soz, just re-read that, didn't mean it to sound annoyed lol :suicide:

Yash that's fine. In response to what you said about tone control, yeah this is true but then what is the point in having the controls on there in the first place then? i feel its good beucase to hvae it there as you can alter the sound to your preference for example i like a bit more bass and a slight bit of extra treble.
 
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